On July 19, 1996, Jack Cerone was released from the Federal Bureau of Prisons with only a couple of days to live. Aiuppa would never have to lift a finger to kill Jackie, though.
The job of killing Cerone was done for him via the prison doctors that prescribed Cerone a dated/generic blood pressure medication. The medication’s use had been suspended in the outside world for many years because it caused ulcerated sores inside of the intestines (former Dr. Joseph Giacchino explained this to me). These sores actually caused intestinal-related cancer inside of the doomed gangster.
In Cerone’s final days as a free but doomed man, he managed to have a couple of bites of an Armand’s Pizza from the original Armand’s located on Grand Avenue in Elmwood Park, Illinois. It was served at Cerone’s home in Inverness, Illinois. Cerone died a short while later. Several minutes after Cerone’s death, Aiuppa called Cerone’s son asking, “Did he die?” The son answered “yes.” Aiuppa clicked off the phone.
In the end Cerone died a gangster without a gang. A couple of days after Cerone’s death, Johnny DiFronzo, formerly a loyal member of Jackie’s crew, jokingly told Mike (the late former owner of the original Armand’s Pizza), “your pizza killed Jack.” Mike did not know whether to laugh or cry.
DiFronzo laughed.
P.S.
The Cerone family would probably doubt the article that I authored above. One big reason would be that John DiFronzo made it a practice to visit Clara Cerone (late wife of the late gangster Jack) on Christmas Day every year and this meeting sometimes took place at her son’s house. I witnessed it personally one year when I was at the Cerone house in Barrington, Illinois (the home of Jack Esq.).
DiFronzo told me personally that he continued doing it until only a couple of years prior to her death. DiFronzo told me that Clara was spending Christmas in Florida, and he had no other reason to visit the Cerone house but to see her. Since she was indisposed a couple of years prior to her passing, DiFronzo discontinued his visits. I believe DiFronzo told me that he did go to her wake. Keep in mind that he did not go to Jack’s wake in 1996. Most people believe it was to avoid scrutiny. On the contrary, I believe it stemmed from many years of dislike for gangster-Cerone and his spoiled brat of a son.
DiFronzo certainly does not pay respect at the Cerone house any longer. Like Johnny DiFronzo, the only Cerone that I will always love is Clara (nee) Russo.
502 Comments
Ah… Mr. Fosco, all who know Michael Magnafichi, know he loved the late Cerone, and probably now think that Magnafichi hates DiFronzo because of DiFronzo’s shift in loyalty against Cerone.
Dear Rich,
I would agree with that to a point. However, Cerone was not loyal to some of his own men.
Joe, great article! Difronzo seems to have reaped what Joey O had for a short time in the way of the offshore connections. The Ferriola/Infelice/
LaPietra/Calabrese types seemed happy enough with gambling and loansharking locally. The Paul/Joe B team worked great ehen they where both alive but when Paul died there was a bit of a housecleaning. Is Lumpy a Paul guy or Joe B?
Dear Father,
I will get back to you on the Lumpy question. I would say Joe B. I am going to double check.
Mr. Jack Cerone, Esquire, is going to be incensed –INCENSED– when he reads this article. I sure hope Jack Cerone, Esquire, is ready for this.
Maybe his in laws will stop bragging to restaurant and golf course employees about the “mob” family they married into?
It is rumored that Michael Magnafichi dislikes John DiFronzo because the latter made an offensive remark about the former’s late-father.
Dear Beebs,
Yes, I know of the rumor you are referring to and I believe it matters a great deal to Magnafichi. However, I believe that DiFronzo’s lack of loyalty to Cerone does play a role in Maganfichi’s feelings for DiFronzo.
Gerald “Dinger” Carusiello is an interesting character. I understand that his murder is due to the fact that he revealed the to Accardo (and the other higher-ups) the identities of the burglars who had robbed Accardo’s home of some jewelry. In retaliation, Accardo ordered the murders, all of which made some major headlines. Carusiello was then killed to insulate mob leadership from potential charges/indictments in the event that he ever attempted to cooperate with the authorities.
I’ve never heard of “Jerry Carsello, aka ‘Ding-Dong’ and/or ‘Dinger’” being killed due to booze-related clowning or grab-ass.
Dear Beebs,
Dinger was solid, no one was worried that he was beefing; however, he was saying and doing things while he would go out on the town that made Aiuppa have him knocked down. Aiuppa was not a risk taker.
Contrary to popular belief, Accardo was not responsible for ordering the murders of the burglars that robbed his home. Cerone was the one who took it the hardest and wanted to show others an example. Of course, Aiuppa agreed. Accardo was not disappointed about the murders of the burglars; he was appreciative that Cerone and Aiuppa looked out for him.
In fact, one of Ceone’s men quoted Cerone regarding a conversation about whether some of the murder victims were actually innocent. Cerone was quoted as saying, “sometimes the innocent have to go with the guilty.”
Here is a link to what appears to be another really great Outfit site: http://ganglandchicago.blogspot.com/
It contains many, many great pics including one of Willie Messino. Ironically, it contains a quote from Jack Cerone about not drinking on the job because it might allow one to take unnecessary risks.
Dear Beebs,
Yes, Cerone often preached that his men should not drink on the job. However, he was usually drinking very heavily when he would preach.
Is it true that Mooney considered Aiuppa to be a whiner and a pain in the ass?
Dear Inhaler,
I do not know. I will look into it.
There’s a DiFronzo family from Elmhurst IL (or at least associated with a Roman Catholic parish in Elmhurst) and they are extremely church-going. I’m wondering if No Nose considers himself to be Catholic, and if so, does he attend. I’m fascinated by the dichotomy: mobster/Catholic.
Dear Inhaler,
DiFronzo has two living brothers and a couple more that died. It is possible the Elmhurst family is relatives of his. What is the first name? I would assume that DiFronzo considers himself a Catholic. I am unaware of the various religious practices that he may exercise. The most that I have seen him do for others is buy an occasional drink at a bar.
I find your character sketch of John DiFronzo a little hard to believe. To say that he hates his criminal colleagues is one thing, but to say that he hates the entire organization–an organization that has made him a very rich man who has served very little time in prison–is quite another. If he was part of the committee, along with with Carlisi and Messino, that ruled the Outfit into the 90’s, whatever put a foul taste in his mouth, re: the mob, must have occurred in the last 10 or 15 years. I wonder what happened.
Also, I don’t think he and Andriacchi hate each other–Greedy and Joe A. grew up and came up together and are dear friends.
Dear Bon,
DiFronzo was truly framed in the matter that put him in prison during the early 1990’s. I would say that would do it for most people, as far as putting a bad taste in ones mouth (as you put it). DiFronzo is not the kind of person that accepts being framed. Some would say, “Well I killed a lot of people and should be sentenced to the electric chair – I am going to count my blessings for merely being framed over some stupid Indian reservation deal that I had nothing to do with.”
The DiFronzo’s and Andriacchi are not fond of each other no matter what their past is – it does not mean that people rich in history are forever close the rest of their lives (things happen).
How was he framed? Please elaborate.
Dear Bot,
The only evidence that linked DiFronzo to the complaint was a wiretap of a coconspirator referring to ‘the guy on the farm’. Because DiFronzo owned a farm, it was believed to be DiFronzo. I am sorry but I do not know all the details leading up to the statement that I shared with you. However, I would be glad to work for you if you would like me to do some research on the subject. My hourly rate is not too expensive.
Joe-
Believe that DiFronzo was caught discussing the scam at Rocky’s in Melrose Park along with Carlisi, Don Angel, and probably Dom Cortina.
Furthermore, Angel’s brother in law Mike Caracci, was the point man on the Rincon Reservation scam and was DiFronzo’s driver in the Elmwood Park crew correct? Given that DiFronzo was the boss at this time, a potential scam this large would have to have been discussed with him directly.
Another story comes out of this too…this was in the time after Spilotro was knocked down and DiFronzo sent word to their LA pointman Chris Petti to collect a few of Spilotros outstanding debts in Las Vegas…so Petti recruited two Boston transplants, Anthony and Carmen DiNunzio who were subsequently caught shaking people down who Spilotro had loaned money to.
These shakedowns were done directly because the Outfit was needing more cash to invest in this Indian deal.
Carmen DiNunzio was recently indicted as the head of the Patriarca crime family in Boston. His brother Anthony now runs the family.
Dear Logic,
I believe that Rocky’s Restaurant closed in 1990 (no point intended). The conversation that may have occurred at Rocky’s was somewhat ambiguous, if I recall correctly. Trust me; I am the last person alive that would try to clear DiFronzo of anything. Instead, I have charged him with murder in a number of my articles. I have one question. What was the outcome of the federal case as it related to DiFronzo?
I’m aware of Rocky’s closing years ago, but believe the wheels were set in motion for this particular scam in the 80s as the Outfit tried to find another large-scale casino skim to replace what they had just lost in Vegas.
DiFronzo was convicted of conspiracy, one count of mail fraud and two counts of wire fraud. Jurors acquitted him of five mail fraud charges and split on extortion charges.
http://articles.latimes.com/1993-03-19/news/mn-12877_1_mail-fraud-charges
Dear Logic,
What portion of the convictions was reversed on appeal?
I saw that news report in Chicago about the leaders of the outfit all meeting together at a restaurant and then the reporter speaks to No Nose on camera outside. Andriacchi was their with the rest of the crew.
Dear Kels,
If you are referring to the Chuck Goudie piece, Andriacchi was nowhere in sight.
Interesting article.
Joe,
Is Jack the Lawyer going to be very very upset at this article?
Dear Bot,
I hope not. I would never dream of upsetting anyone. I would like to think that Counselor Cerone is sophisticated enough to deal with such information in an appropriate manner.
Did DiFronzo have any appreciation for Angelini? Angelini was supposedly a very gentle and understand man–who, along with Cortina–never resorted to violence or threats to collect debts.
Dear David,
Angelini, Cortina and George Colucci were probably the most decent human beings affiliated with the Outfit – I believe that Difronzo would share my view.
Were Angelini, Cortina and George Colucci made?
What can you tell us about Angelini? I understand that he was regarded as some kind of brilliant gambling expert who was involved in some pretty capers and enterprises. I wonder if Angelini had to make his bones via violence or if he proved his worth by his wits.
Dear David,
If I remember correctly, Angelini and Cortina were ‘made’, via Joe Ferriola or Turk (likely Joe). Turk and Ferriola ‘made’ (no pun intended) a great deal of money with Donald and Dominic, which is what lead to their being ‘made’ as Outfit members. Colucci on the other hand was not ‘made’. Ferriola enjoyed giving George a hard time with things – Ferriola got a kick out of giving George a hard time.
http://abclocal.go.com/wls/story?section=news/iteam&id=7613208
Apparently, One Armed Jerry Scalise was “made.” Very interesting. I’m wondering if they might try to get him to cooperate against Sarno who was allegedly present at the bookstore where Michael Oliveri was gunned down.
Dear David,
“Ollie” as Michael was called actually also went by the name Michael Oliver. The entire Cicero faction would be the people to target if the feds want to pin a rap on someone in connection to Ollie’s death. Sad, he left 3-daughters behind.
The feds have been trying to pin people in Cerone’s crew on the death of Rich Penachio for many years. It is tough.
Did Penachio die in a firebombing incident? I assume that by Cerone’s crew, you mean the DiFronzo’s, in particular.
Dear David,
Yes and yes.
Joe, what caused the beef between the DiFronzo’s and Andriacci. Are they cousins?
Dear Father,
I am not sure that what happened between DiFronzo and Andriacchi is very serious. And I am not sure it was one situation putting them at odds. I think it was a series of events having transpired over a number of years. However, whatever it is that compromised their relations, it certainly magnified after DiFronzo was released from prison in the 1990’s.
They are not cousins.
Joe, thanks I was thinking of Carlisi and Tournebene..cousins. Better Pizza Armands or Villa Nova?
Dear Father,
The old Armand’s was the best – in my opinion.
Andriacchi is Joey the clown’s cousin.
Dear Rick,
Not that I am aware.
Joe,
Is Joey DiFronzo a serious gangster? What do you know about him? It was said on this blog that he was responsible for bringing Schweiss into the Outfit. That seems strange since Schweiss was one of Lumbo’s guys.
Dear David,
Joseph DiFronzo is not a ‘made’ member of the Chicago Outfit. However, having Johnny as a brother makes him a very serious person. Joseph brought in a number of the psychopaths – he brought them into his brother’s reach, which is why some of the psychopaths are in crews other than DiFronzo’s crew. Members of some crews had been used in different crews for special assignments. Joseph had the ability to advise his brother on the various psychopaths among the other crews (i.e., the German).
Interesting…I had always thought Schweiss was related to Marshall Caifano through his mother, hence where he got his start through the Grand Ave. Crew. He’s much older than Joe and seems to be much more powerful in the 1970s, essentially becoming one of Lumbo’s lieutenants when Joe seemed to be nothing more than a thief burglar and drug dealer.
Dear Logic,
Schweiss could have been related to Al Capone; however, Joe DiFronzo brought him into the reach of Johnny DiFronzo. I believe Joe DiFronzo is 75-years old, not much younger than the German.
Johnny DiFronzo was one of Jack’s top guys since the 1950’s. Any brother of Johnny DiFronzo was to be considered very capable (thru Johnny).
Joe, my hunch is that Butchie Petrocelli shot Oliver and it was unsanctioned but Sarno was there and Dukie Basile, Nick C and a dead Gerry Scarpelli have put Sarno at the murder. The papers reported about two informants, long time members, one will be Dukie he has been in WP for 16 18 years not sure who the other one is? Any thoughts? Scalise is not the cooperating type, so I dont think its gonna be him although it seems that the feds are working that possiblity hard, witherhand is a throughback albeight on the lower end of things and Nick C did work with him. What do your sources think about the whole LaPietra thing they have Scalise on tape saying Jimmy I ok’d the job. Can you imagine DiFronzo or Lombardo giving authorization to rob Accardo’s daughter…please.
Dear Father,
I know someone that is aware of the actual triggerman on the Oliver murder. However, he would not divulge the name of the person. I tried to get it. I am sorry that I do not know who it is. I do know the current Cicero faction was well involved in the low-level matter, which occurred many years ago (1979 or 1980?).
I will check with my sources on the Jimmy I thing. Thus far, the subject did not come up.
Dear Father,
After thinking for a bit, I believe I recall hearing about the Butch theory in relation to the Oliver death – it has been years since I had the conversation that I am recalling.
I thought Solly C was there. In fact, I think that’s the first time I heard his name in connection to any Outfit-related thing.
David,
I believe you might be right.
Joe was the penachio death portrayed in the 1992 movie hoffa?
Dear Wondering,
I do not remember the 1992 movie Hoffa very well. I watched it only once, eighteen years ago. I do not recall hearing that Penachio’s death was portrayed in the movie, but do not go by my knowledge on it.
“The Michael Oliver hit was another Outfit masterpiece that stymied investigators until Scarpelli filled in the blanks. Oliver, a long-time friend and associate of Bobby Salerno, operated a pornographic book store in Elk Grove Village that was in direct competition with another such establishment owned by one Vito Caliendo who enjoyed close ties to Butch Petrocelli. According to Scarpelli he accompanied Salerno, Salvatore Cautedella, Scalise, and Mike Sarno when they entered the store one night with the intention of “wrecking the joint” and thereby imposing an economic hardship that would prevent later claim that neither he nor his associates intended to whack Oliver but someone…he wasn’t sure just who it was…had a gun.”
— “The Not-so-Glamorous Career of
Chicago Hitman Gerald Scarpelli Revealed”
By: Richard Lindberg
Dear David,
I have always been under the impression that Oliver’s death was accidental.
Joe Jackie Cerone Sr. had a brother they called “Blackie” or something like that right? Used to run a lot of gambling and believe he had something iff Lake Street.
What ever happened to the Cerone brother?
Dear Logic,
I do not recall a brother “Blackie.” I will look into it.
Logic may be referring to “Blackie” Baratta, who was part of the crew that met on Sundays at the old Golden Bear restaruant on North Avenue (Paul, Joe B, etc.).
I’d imagine that your life is no longer in jail with Fratto going to jail and/or possibly cooperating and with the heat on Giacchino and possibly Cerone.
Also, if DiFronzo is distancing himself from the Outfit, the last thing he’s going to want to do is have anything to do with a hit.
Dear David,
I hope you are correct – and you might be correct. In the meantime, will you start my car for me every morning (I will pay you)?
Aiuppa must have been a really vicious bastard. Maybe the most bloodthirsty of all the bosses. Joe B. commanded respect. Sure people were scared of him, but they respected and admired him. The underlings feared Aiuppa, and it was through fear that he kept the Outfit in line. Ever take notice of how the number of murders and violent acts tapered off after Aiuppa was incarcerated, and how is plummeted upon his death? Aiuppa, it seems, was a very scary, cruel and greedy man. I’m sure there were many in the Outfit who breathed a little easier upon his passing.
Dear David,
I agree.
Joe, did you ever have the chance to meet Black Sam, or did your family have any connection to him? He was another vicious person who had only a little more self-restraint than Aiuppa. He personally killed Nick D’Andrea, Jasper Campise and Johnny Gattuso.
Dear David,
Black Sam was Aiuppa’s guy. And he was my second father’s cousin. My second father was a man by the name of Charlie Nicosia. Charlie died nearly 20-years ago. After my father died in 1987, Charlie told me that he was my new father. Yes, my father was well acquainted with Black Sam and I met Sam very casually thru Charlie in the late 1980’s.
Fore the record, if my second father were alive today, I would be disowned over the position that I have taken against the Outfit in recent years. Then again, Charlie would have prevented the trouble that came to me in the first place.
Ever meet Sam’s brother Ross? Story goes that Sam and Ross grew up near Cicero and joined Aiuppa’s crew back in the 1930s. Ross couldn’t stand Aiuppa and headed for Buffalo, where he eventually became an influential CAPO in the Maggadino Crime Family and was caught attending Appalachin.
Since Ross was so influential on the east coast, knew families in Pittsburgh, Philly and NY, Sam became the Outfit’s designated liason to fly around the country on behalf of the Outfit in the 1960s and 70s. Hence the name “wings.”
Ross passed in the late 1980s and I’m sure Sam attended the funeral. The Outfit and the Buffalo family have always been close.
Dear Logic,
Thanks for sharing the information. I was aware of Sam’s east coast connections. However, I never met a brother Ross.
What about the nephews of Carlisi, the DiMaggio brothers? I only know Dom DiMaggio, but know he has a brother too.
They are nephews of Sam and Ross through a sister and grew up in Chicago, went to Buffalo to work for Roy, but after they were ejected from unions in Buffalo, they came back to Chicago in the mid 1980s.
I believe they linked up and probably still work within the Outfit. I know Dom was a VP or something for Local 2 in Buffalo and then after getting kicked out, immediately got a job in the Chicago Laborers District Council which is hillarious.
Do you know any of Sam’s east coast connections by name? Also Sam sold his home in Bartlett to that idiot Anthony Giannone right?
Dear Logic,
I do not know anything about any of the matters indicated in your comment.
Curious is Nicosia was made?
Dear David,
Charlie was most definitely a ‘made’ guy. Charlie was a top advisor to all the old regime bosses under Capone. Charlie had connections that most influential people wish they had. If Charlie told you ‘it’s taken care of’, it was.
Even though No Nose and Pete DiFronzo are not active, do they still have heavies at their disposal who would be willing to take and carry out orders of violence if they were commanded to do so? Has this ever happened?
Dear Graham,
OMG! What a question! My answer is YES!
Are these heavies/hit men who the DiFronzo’s have authority over well-known or are they sleepers?
Do you know of any made guys who the public would be shocked to find out that they are associated with organized crime?
Dear Prittle,
DiFronzo has both sleepers and well-known people. Look, I really do not want to drop those sorts of names for fear that I will motivate someone to do something desperate.
Dear Joe and readers:
There seems to be a fair amount of interest in Aiuppa. Here are the FBI files on him, publicly available via FOIA:
http://foia.fbi.gov/foiaindex/aiuppa.htm
(Notice that there is no analysis or explanation regarding his wardrobe.)
I believe that the FBI is required, by law, to furnish their files on other deceased mobsters upon receipt of a formal FOIA request. But be advised that documents pertaining to other high-profile mobsters are available through this website due to public interest.
Joe, to be frank with you, it would be interesting to see what they had on old Nicosia. Perhaps the files on Chuckie Inglese “English” would shed light on his murder. The files on Jack “the spaghetti sauce stirrer” Cerone would probably be intriguing, as well.
Thank you.
It might also be worth looking at Lee Magnafichi’s file since there’s ZERO out there about him. One mobwatcher I know doubts his existence.
Dear Joe,
Do you know anything about Johnny Roselli? I’m not much of a conspiracy theorist, but it seems that he and Mooney might have had, at least, some knowledge of what went into the Kennedy assassination. The mob, in general, had plenty of motive–especially Carlos Marcello with whom Mooney and Roselli were closely allied. What is your opinion on the matter?
Dear Neil,
I will answer simply by saying that based on things that I have learned thru family, friends and associates over the years, I would bet my left hand that the Chicago Outfit played a fundamental role in the Kennedy assassination. And, I predict that it will come out via official notice in the future.
Dear Joe,
When you say the Chicago Outfit, I’m sure you’re not talking about the Accardo “faction” but Giancana’s circle, right? It seems that Accardo would’ve had the good sense to stay the hell away from a situation like that. Can you elaborate at all?
From what I understand, various Italian-American crime organizations enlisted the help of foreign gunmen/assassins, New York having the smallest role in the cooperative ordeal.
A now-deceased foreign criminal who was involved in the French Connection heroin operation–and who was shown to have inside knowledge of the assassination’s logistics–claimed that the assassins were picked up at the Mexican border by an Italian-speaking member of the Chicago Outfit who drove them to a “safe house” in Dallas.
Very, very creepy stuff.
You should consider writing an article about it.
Dear Neil,
I am referring to the Giancana faction; however, there is no way Accardo would not have been consulted on something of such magnitude. I will consider an article on the matter.
I read some of the Auippa FBI files…some interesting stuff: Joey O started working legit at 12, and between the age of 20-25 he went from truck driver age 20 to a Tavern and hotel owner and Outfit and Labor “Boss” at age 25. How many bodies do you think Joey O had by 25? Also he was connected to John Dillinger’s bank crew. I wonder if Jerry Scalise gave Michael Mann all that insight into how the outfit gave, and then, took away protection from Dillinger sealing his fate. Dillinger brought too much heat to the gambling revenue of the national wire service in the film with Johnny Depp. Joe B. has been credited for making that happen threw murder and intimidation, thus raising his Outfit profile from bodyguard to Boss. I wonder if that character in the film who delivered the bad news to Dillinger, but slipped him some money and whispered good luck to him was based on old man Joey O?
Here’s one of Mooney’s:
http://foia.fbi.gov/giancana/giancana1.pdf
The more I read this, the more I realize that he was maybe the biggest mobster in the country at the time.
There’s a transcript of a conversation in which he mentions Genovese, Lucchesse, Profaci, and Anastasia. He flew all over the country. (Pittsburgh! LOL). Man, he can be funny on tape.
It’s hard to believe that the Outfit did a good job of honoring their seat on the Commission after Giancana went to Mexico.
I’m not sure that Alderisio, Cerone or Aiuppa had the business acumen, intelligence and “swagger” to be as effective as Mooney.
I doubt Accardo had any interest in it at all.
Dear Neil,
Accardo gave it up to Mooney. However, out of respect Accardo was consulted on major issues. I contend that the Chicago Outfit was doomed the very second Giancana took his final breath.
Dear Joe,
What can you tell us about Joe Gags? It’s hard to imagine someone as allegedly cold-blooded as DiFronzo adoring another human being, let alone another mobster.
Also, are you aware of the existence of a son or nephew by the name of Gary Gagliano? A long time ago, I came across his mugshot. In it, he is sporting what appears to be a “mullet” hairstyle, which means it is short at the front and sides, and long in the back. (Be advised that the mullet hairstyle is commonly ridiculed, and people who wear them are not generally perceived as having a serious attitude toward life.) I can’t believe the bosses would let that slide. (Maybe they gave him a pass because he’s Joe Gags’ son/nephew?) Is Gary still active and/or made? Thank you.
Dear Stephen,
Gary is Joe’s nephew and is alive and active, and I believe he is ‘made’. I will double check to see if he is ‘made’, but I think he is. Gary is someone that DiFronzo would trust enough today if he wanted some ‘heavy work’ done.
Joe Gags was well liked by every crew in the city. My father liked him. Everyone liked him. Again, he was very well liked. It was no secret that he was somewhat open-minded with his sexual orientation. However, he could be as ruthless as necessary when required.
what do you mean by open minded
Dear John,
What do you think I mean?
Wait a minute, are you telling us that J.G. was known to putt from the rough, in a manner of speaking?
Dear Stephen,
Yes (I think I know what you mean).
Was Nick Nitti made? Also, what about Fat Vic Stramaglio?
Dear Paranoia,
I know of two Nick Nitti’s. One is definitely not ‘made’. And the other one is probably not ‘made’. I never heard that Stramaglio was ‘made’. I can double check.
Joe, you might be providing some insight into the decline of the Outfit, here.
Edward Gibbon contended that Rome fell because it came to lack virtue, and developed into a weak, effeminate people.
While the Outfit has never had any degree of “virtue” (per se), it’s now clear that it may also be slowly developing into a weak and effeminate organization if it’s employing poofs and mullet-wearers. The fact that you’re able to say what you want on here with apparent “impunity” also supports this theory.
Dear Guy,
You have a valid point.
In addition Rome fell due to inbreding and lead poisoning. One could accuse the outfit of the former.
Joe,
Who is Anthony Cerone who appears on Burstein’s mob chart?
Another older name on there is Roland Ignoffo. Is he heavy?
How about the Cassanno’s?
Thanks.
Dear Guy,
I have only met one Anthony “Tony” Cerone. I believe he is old man Jack’s nephew. The Tony I am talking about is a “zero”. He might be in his early 60’s. The Cerone’s were/are weird people.
You have convinced me that they are weird people with the many stories and anecdotes you have shared. The “I was my father’s real underboss” story was about the most embarrassing thing I’ve ever heard. Someone posted those remarks about a dog role play sex/urination scenario, which was very bizarre as well. Are you telling us that it gets weirder than that? It would be interesting to hear more.
Dear Stephen,
Perhaps soon I will write more on the Cerone’s.
Dear Guy,
I believe I might be related thru marriage to Roland – I do not know very much about him. Angelo Cassano is a rough guy, and was close to some heavyweight Outfit guys over the years, such as Lee Magnafichi. I do not know any of his brothers.
Roland Ignoffo is dead.
Dear Logic,
Thank you for the information. Yes, he died on July 23, 2006.
Joe,
Even though Elmwood Park is ‘inactive’ are it’s old crew members the guys that would be available for heavy work if No Nose or Peter needed something done. Specifically, I’m interested in these guys whose names have been gleaned from various mob charts:
1. Tony Dote
2. Francis Mazza
3. Nino Cisterino
4. Vito Cassano
5. Angelo Cassano
6. Gino Cassano
7. Dominick Cassano
8. Larry Petitt
9. Bobby Abbinanti
10. Tony Spavone
11. Tony Cipriani
My take on the list:
I have no personal knowledge of number 11. As for the rest of the list, number 8 might be the only ‘made’ man listed below. His brother Joe was definitely ‘made’.
Number 1 is a joke like his brother Carl. Carl never paid the Messino family what he owed Willie. Now Tony spends his time with his head up Marco’s you know what.
Number 2 is a heist man.
Number 3 used to be with Al Tocco.
Number 4–7 are businessmen and gamblers. Number 5 is a rough person.
Number 8 is well known well-liked person.
Number 9 is definitely one of DiFronzo’s sleepers.
Number 10 makes my sides hurt from laughing – he is a real joke, very much like Rudy Fratto, however number 10 is not a gangster whatsoever.
1. Tony Dote
2. Francis Mazza
3. Nino Cisterino
4. Vito Cassano
5. Angelo Cassano
6. Gino Cassano
7. Dominick Cassano
8. Larry Petitt
9. Bobby Abbinanti
10. Tony Spavone
11. Tony Cipriani
Number 2 is known as Pat – unless there is another Mazza I am unaware of.
I should add, number 3 and 9 a very rough people too.
Nino is a Chicago Heights guy and I believe is close with Michael Giorango. He’s up there in age these days, but his sons are likely watching his interests.
Angelo “Angel” Cassano is most definitely a made-man and like Magnifichi and others, has issues with driving sober. Not sure about the other Cassano brothers though. Angelo is known as a hot head.
Fat Vick Stramaglio is a long-time Elmwood Park guy who might be made.
Agree with Joe on Bobby The Boxer and Larry Pettit. I believe Tony Cipriani is dead.
Everyone confuses Tony Spavone with being in the Outfit because of the prevelance of Outfit guys eating there. From what Joe explained to me, he’s like Artie Bucco.
Dear Logic,
Despite your opinion, I know that Angelo is not ‘made’.
Joe–
We can only speculate at this point, but you used to run with more of these guys, than I did. Glad you agree he’s a rough guy…definitely not one to mess with.
Dear Logic,
Again, I know that Angelo is NOT ‘made’. Thanks.
This is my question to everyone here, how do you know that all the people are still doing anything with the mob or for that fact even live anywhere near Chicago? If you are not 100% sure that they are that is called slander and can be sued for it and can also be fined. the Cassano brothers lived in Melrose Park so how did they have anything to do with Elmwood Park? Is it that you’re just making that up too?
Dear Some,
Personally, I never indicated the whereabouts of Cassano’s.
Dear Some,
I never indicated that Cassano’s had anything to do with Elmwood Park, even though one of them opened a business in that town recently.
What does it matter if they opened a business? How do you know if they are not a legit person that is going straight? You don’t do you? Instead of trying to make everyone look bad do research on the person and then you can post what you find. You posted the names of the Cassano’s so what you are saying is that the whole family is involved in this when you have no facts. You said, “Number 4–7 are businessmen and gamblers.” This may not be true and you just are here telling everyone that it is when you have no proof there for it is called slander.
Dear Some,
I cannot believe that anyone would complain about being called a businessperson. As for gambling, I have shared no details. Whoever you are, assuming you know the Cassano’s, ask Angelo if he would prefer that I write about my personal observations relating to him over the years, or if leaving it as ‘businessperson’ and ‘gambler’ are good enough. In addition, I would like to point out, America is such a wonderful country where people can freely express themselves and others can file libel suits to clear their name if their name has truly been defamed and damages are caused. Of all the capable people that I have written about over the years, in some cases charging them with murder, not once has a valid claim of libel been filed against me. Why is that? Some have suggested that because I am not a rich man, why anyone would attempt to collect – how about the fact that after a court would find one guilty of libel the complainant can seek a court order removing the articles in question. None of my wealthy subjects has tried doing that. I am sorry, former Dr. Giacchino had tried, but failed miserably because I speak the truth. Others have suggested that my site is not taken seriously enough for anyone to worry about it. That is a poor excuse. My site generates thousand of readers, allows anyone searching the name of a subject to immediately pull-up my site and the information that I wrote about them. And, I have thousands and thousands of comments to point at – if my site meant nothing, why would anyone leave a comment?
If you continue to do what you are doing, I could only assume that you are not an ally of the Cassano’s and are merely trying to instigate me to write about my personal observations relating to Angelo, instead of leaving it simple.
SomeGuy,
So you know, there are other sources, publicly available, that label these individuals as Outfit associates–if not soldiers. At least 8 of them have been named in Chicago news reports. At least 2 have been named in books by a former FBI agent responsible for investigating organized crime in Chicago. A question was raised, and Joe shared his opinion / understanding. Notice that he suspended judgement on the individual who had has no firsthand knowledge of.
As to defamation, that is a very serious charge. But as many of these individuals have been documented as having some role (however minor) in organized criminal activities, they would have no standing to file such a suit.
So you know Abbinanti was named as a mob gambling figure in a news report by Chuck Goudie from last year. He admitted to having been involved in mob gambling rackets before.
I imagine if he was interesting in suing someone or some entity for libel, it would have been Goudie and his news station. He didn’t.
Stephen
My point is that he or you do not know if all the the Cassano’s or anyone on the list is still active. The lists that you can get publicly are older lists. Some of the people might be dead and you’re a assuming that they all are still active members when in reality they are may not be. How can you just assume that? For instance, Vito Cassano has done his time and left everything 22 years ago, so why even mention his name when he has nothing to do with anything?
Here is the link to author Scott M. Burstein’s “Chicago Outfit 2010” flow chart:
http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/7034/outfit.gif
Note that the Elmwood Park street crew, as fleshed out by him, is far greater in number than anyone has indicated here.
Dear Ernie,
For the record, I take serious issue with the accuracy of Burstein’s chart.
Ernie
Some of those images look like they are about 50 years old. I don’ think most of the people are still in it or alive.
Mr.Fosco, thanks for the link, I personally didn’t even know it existed, the only one I’ve heard about was a Chicago Crime Commisson partial one! By the way, do you remember Covellos bar on Grand and Ogden, it was across the street from LaRoc’s Hotdog stand? I believe it’s now some yuppie bar, but was it or is it presently an Outfit owned venture? I noticed a Covello listed under Christy’s photo on the chart and just got to thinking?? For that matter how about the restaurant that was across the street from Covellos, I believe it was named Lenzi’s, real nice place, been gone for awhile now, just wondering if they were connected!!
Dear Ugotz,
I am not positive if those places are/were connected. And, if so, I would not know how connected (mild or major). I would gladly check into it. May I ask what the basis of your concern is?
I would imagine that many places in that area have some sort of connection. Again, I do not know what level these connections rise to. What does it mean for the hotdog stand if its owner is a gangster, or the friend of a gangster? Would the hotdogs taste different?
P.S. I am sorry, I do not recall sending you a link.
Mr Fosco, I found the link on your site! As for my asking is because I happen to be know the restaurant owner’s son, as for the stand, I went to high school with the original owners grandkids.
typo i know
Lot of dead people on that chart. Joe Shine (Joseph Amabile) has been dead for over 30 years. Hell, it has Bruno “the Bomber” Roti on there. He’s been dead since 1957! The chart is about 75% bullshit, as are many of the photos, alleged positions, and nicknames. Furthermore, it has people on there who are just relatives of current or deceased Outfit guys who have been smeared simply because of who their fathers/uncles/etc. are or were. Better look close, Joe, your name might be on there somewhere. LOL!
Dear 123,
I was named after Joe Amabile, Sr. My father and him were extremely close while they both served Teets. And, my brother Paul was named after Paul Ricca. My father knew Paul and idolized him. My oldest brother was named after my father and I have one other brother named Ralph, who was named after our late Uncle Ralph Nappi. Most of you never heard of the late Ralph Nappi. Ralph Nappi was killed around 1941 in Wisconsin during a saloon fight. A drunkard shot him for no good reason. The police immediately appeared and arrested the killer. Later Teets attempted to fix the court case for the killer so he could murder the man ‘himself’ on the outside. However, the judge sensed what was gong to take place and refused to go along with it. The man lived in prison for years and eventually died there.
Sometimes I confuse people when I refer to the Nappi’s as my uncles. In fact, they were my father’s brothers-in-law for many years, since the 1940’s. As some of you might recall, my father had two sons with his first family and two with his second. However, for many years (after my fathers passing) both of his families became close. I had called my stepmother mom. My Uncle Romie who was actually my stepmother’s brother was amazingly close to me. We befriended each other in the early 1990’s; however, it only lasted a few years because his mind grew weak by the late 1990’s due to senility. Nonetheless, I did not abandon him or his wife, Aunt Maryon – in the end Romie hardly remembered anyone other than people from 50-years earlier. I continued to buy their groceries whenever I could, and never took a penny for it – not like some people did.
I have decided to write an article on Romie and Ralph Nappi. I will begin it sometime this weekend. You will be amazed.
It seems to me that SB’s chart is so far out there that it isn’t even funny. Why Logic and others allow it to fill their head with disturbing illusions is beyond me.
A real Outfit chart would have about 30 names on it–with no Vegas or “Italy” operatives. (What a joke!)
Joe, have you ever considered doing a chart based on what you know?
Dear Christina,
I do not know enough to do a chart. I do not want to embarrass myself the way SB has done.
Joe, What do you know about Anthony Centracchio was he a front for Lumpy or Marcello? or did he carry his own weight?
Dear Father,
I will look into it, right now I would say Marcello. I will check.
I believe the answer to this question is Jimmy Marcello. Marcello used his cousin / nephew who was a suburban police officer to deliver messages to Centracchio. I believe they also met, periodically, at a breakfast restaurant in Villa Park on Roosevelt Rd. do discuss business in person.
He took over for Louie Eboli working under Lombardo. Centracchio was a Melrose Park guy which was Grand Avenue territory.
Dear Logic,
I beg to differ with you.
Joe–Please explain. Was Centracchio within a different crew? Eboli was definitely a Grand Avenue guy.
I knew Tony Jr. for a long time and also know a lot of his sisters went on to marry sons of wiseguys like Dirgie Imperato. Tony Sr. was above all things a doting father.
Dear Logic,
Centracchio was aligned with Marcello and those guys. Eboli belonged to Aiuppa.
I think Steve Stills is right, but would I would be interested if you could confirm…Marcello seemed to have a a lot going on…I think the problem for Jimmy was that he became the main target and the feds saw him as “the guy” to chop down because as you’ve documented Johnny D wasnt interested in growing the criminal enterprises but Jimmy sure was. Just my opinion.
Joe
Just wondering what kind of business did Angelo Cassano open in Elmwood Park ?
Dear Tom,
I never said Angelo opened anything in Elmwood Park. One of his brothers opened a gold store, i.e. pawnshop on Harlem Avenue, just north of Grand Avenue.
So, with DiFronzo and Andriacchi keeping each other at arm’s length, as well as having effectively abandoned the Outfit’s streeet activity, is Elmwood Park even a street crew anymore? Is there any mafia activity going on there?
Dear Mike,
Elmwood Park has been clear of Outfit business for many years.
So is it just Cicero then–with a random racket here and there on Lake Street in the suburbs or in the Village of Oakbrook?
Dear Pasquale,
I guess you can say that. However, I am unaware of Oak Brook’s connection.
Joe
Sorry misunderstood you that it was a cassono My mistake keep up the good work
Joe,
Sarno was allowed to attend his cousins funeral I heard the cousin did time for attempt murder. Do u know if its true? and if related to outfit business. I know the name but will not leave it until you can confirm.
Dear Father,
Give me a day or so.
Dear Father,
Yes, Mike Sarno was allowed to attend the wake of his cousin Harry last week.
Dear Joe,
Are you aware of an Al Sarno? There was some discussion about this on the SunTimes Outfit blog. Thank you.
Dear Nick,
I know Al Sarno, he has a wonderful boat up north. I knew his now late mother Rose, his now late brother Jimmy and his sister Carole.
Joe,
Do you believe that there will be an Outfit again when DiFronzo and Andriacchi pass away or go to jail, thus clearing the way for ambitious gangsters like Jimmy I, Sarno, or even Jimmy Marcello if he wins his appeal?
Dear Nick,
The ‘way’ is already clear for such. DiFronzo and Andriacchi do not care what anyone outside of their crew does. They want to make sure their crew is not doing anything that will automatically involve them. Their crew is defunct, for the most part – just the way Johnny wants it.
Is Al Sarno related to Large Sarno? Also, why is no one resurrecting the Outfit if No Nose doesn’t care what anyone but his own crew does? Are they having trouble finding members?
Dear Nick,
I am confident that the two Sarno families are not related, at least not closely.
The Outfit is not being ‘resurrected’ to its old level for a number of reasons. Most importantly, the smart capable people that it would require realize the advancements that law enforcement have made, which is a real deterrent. Leaving the willing participants to be the less intelligent ones, who do not have the smarts to organize their own lives, much less an entire Outfit.
LOL. People should start calling the mob “the Black Hand” again.
Adiós, you a**holes!
a long time ago you shared a story about frankie cullotta kicking joe andriacchi’s ass with physical contact. that is until lee magnafichi charged onto the scene causing cullotta to hide underneath a nearby car out of fear for his life.
this is a comical scenario. but speaking of the black hand, did you know that frankie cullotta’s dad was famous in the neighborhood for stomping the hell out of half-assed, independent blackhanders who were trying to shakedown italians?
interesting enough, cullotta himself wanted no part in the actual outfit and instead had his heart set on being an independent blackhander himself–and he even put money on the street, did heavy work, robbed banks and was an all-around successful bad guy. he had curly hair, as well.
people make a joke out of frankie cullotta, but joe, i believe that he was the real deal. do you have any good stories about cullotta.? if he never got out of it, he probably could have been the top boss in today’s world. frank cullotta was the real deal. did you’re dad know him.
i can’t determine if he really didn’t want to be part of the outfit, or if the outfit didn’t want him, so cullotta only PRETENDED to no be interested in joining.
frank cullotta is not a man to mess with. i can assure you of that.
Dear Butch,
I have a source that is 83-years old and wants to remain anonymous. He was close with Frank and I will update my knowledge on Frank thru my source and get back to you soon. I know his brother Joe. However, I have never asked him anything about Frank.
thank you. i’d love to hear more about frankie cullotta. i would never have guessed that he was able to kick andriacchi around like an empty tin can or something.
are you telling us that joe kong is frank’s brother? what is kong’s status in the outfit? i understand that he isn’t made.
i sure hope that joe kong shares some details with you.
Dear Butch,
I never said that Frank kicked Joey A around like an empty tin can. And Joe Kong is a different Joe Cullotta than Frank’s brother. However, I do know both Joe Cullotta’s. Burnstein lists the wrong Joe Cullotta as Joe Kong. Joe Kong is the Outfit related video poker machine owner. Frank Cullotta’s brother, Joe, is a barber. In fact, I think Joe Kongs last name ends in an ‘o’ – Cullatto.
Joe Kong’s name is spelled Calato. The Chicago Crime Commission misspelled his name in their 1997 chart. He was busted and sent to federal prison in that 1980s interstate gambling case that took down Caesar DiVarco. The Chicago Crime Commission’s 1997 chart also misspelled Ronald Ignoffo’s name, who was mentioned here in an above comment. He was also busted in that DiVarco case and his real name is Ronald, NOT Roland. The Roland Ignoffo listed on the Social Security Death Index who died in 2006 is not him, not the right name. Ron Ignoffo was only 35 years old when he was convicted with DiVarco in 1985 and today should be about 60 years old. There is a picture of him and the correct spelling of his name in the Chicago Crime Commission’s 1990 report, along with his date of birth and known hangouts (at that time) listed.
Dear Noname,
Thank you for the information. I was uneasy about the previously indicated age of Ignoffo because of the likeliness that he might be related (thru marriage) to me would suggest that he should be somewhere around 60 years of age (I have not ruled out that the older Ignoffo could be an additional relative). Again thanks for the details.
I will look into the Ignoffo situation for better results.
Dear Joe,
I am impressed with your blog’s current incarnation, American News Post. The writing has improved greatly, and I’m hapy to see that you have returned to offering your expert opinion and gift for analysis on matters concerning corruption and crime in Chicago. I’m also glad to see that you still allow readers to express themselves in whatever manner they would like, even if their contributions to the threads are silly musings (as in the case of Logic), raucous tirades (as in the case of Logic) or verbal make-out sessions with made guys (as in the case of Logic).
I have a few ideas for future articles:
1. analysis of John Kass’ partiality
2. your own mob chart as a kind of answer to Burnstein’s admirable but arguably off-base effort
3. Joe: The Unknown DiFronzo
4. a respectful bio piece on your late-father (It sounds like he was an interesting fellow.)
5. the Outfit and President Kennedy
6. another bombshell article along the lines of the Dominick Senese piece
7. Lee Magnafichi
8. Harlem Playboy and Nick Gio: A disturbing yet fascinating parasocial relationship
Please consider these.
Thank you.
Dear Reason,
You certainly have my work cut out for me (lol). I agree – those are good subjects. However, I am usually too bashful to go into my father’s history in full detail.
I do have the material on the Gio subject; however, I keep putting off rolling up my sleeves and reading it. I can tell you he is currently fighting his case in front of either the Illinois Appellate Court or the Supreme Court, which is what took so long for me to get the records.
I will begin cranking out some of what you are asking for. Thank you for your interest.
Dear Joe,
Do notice something of a strange irony in the fact that Joe Cullatta/o is a barber, while his brother Frank has the most unruly hairstyle in the history of the Chicago mob? It’s like an arsonist having a brother who happens to be the Chief of the Fire Department.
Dear Vito,
Trust me, he is a barber.
Joe, have you ever heard of a Chicago mobster referring to the Outfit as “La Cosa Nostra” or do they say “the Outfit?”
Or, is there another word they say instead of even “the Outfit” such as “the organization?”
Dear Vito,
It is always referred to as the Outfit. However, the real gangsters will also refer to it as ‘us’, ‘we’, ‘our thing’ or ‘this thing’.
Chicago gangsters say “our thing?” That’s interesting.
Joe, I read that the term “made” and “made guy” originated in Chicago. It was later picked up by New York where the term had been “wiseguy.”
Dear Monty,
Lucky Luciano was the person that presented being ‘made’ to the national commission in the 30’s 0r 40’s. It is arguable if Capone was ever ‘made’ because he was in prison when the process began.
It all sounds kind of far fetched, doesn’t it. For Lucky Luciano to present something like this nationally, to me is a joke. I mean, if it was something that was going to make them millions of dollars, I can see it being presented nationally. But, “lets make a club out of this,” come on. Not discrediting you Joe, because it is popular belief.
Dear John,
I think it was a brilliant idea. Giving out memberships instead of money. Only stupid Outfit guys could fall for that one. Most ‘made’ guys never earned a great deal of money, because their bosses did not have to pay them well as they were ‘made’ instead (they had been ‘made’ alright).
Joe,
Touching on this business of Burnstein’s chart…is “soldier” and “associate” even a meaningful distinction in Chicago? I always thought the Outfit had “made guys” and “associates.”
“Connection guys” (like Gussie Alex, Nicosia, and so on) enjoyed higher stature than made guys, though they were definitely lower than the bosses. Can you shed some light on this?
Dear Monty,
Soldiers and/or associates are commonly referred to as if they are ‘with’ someone ‘made’, because they always are.
Talking about the ‘connection guys’ is literally discussing history. The ‘connection guys’ sure were treated very special by the bosses, therefore, they had as much power as the bosses – ‘made’ guys could not use the ‘connection guys’ for anything unless a boss approved it.
Joe, It is well known that the outfit allows other ethnics “in” for a variety of reasons..the german,gus alex etc…but amongst outfit guys how many are sicilian vs other southern italian ancestry Can you fill in the blanks on the italian ancestry of outfit gangsters? Who was the top non italian in the outfit? Albert Tocco or Gus Alex…or an unknown.
Capone- Neopolian
Ricca-Sicilian
Accardo
Giancana
Carlisi-Sicilian
Auippa
DiFronzo
Cerone
Buccieri
Tournebene
Roti
Caruso
LaPietra
Sarno
Infelice
Torello
Calabrese
Magnafachi
Andriacchi
Monteleone
Dear Father,
Your request is tempting; however, I am not sure I have the time to do what you are asking. Can you slim down your request? Thanks.
As an FYI, Albert Tocco and his brother Joseph “Papa Joe” Tocco were both Italian, not Greek as is widely circulated. Furthermore, a lot of Outfit guys such as the Banks family are Italian, but don’t retain Italian last names.
Dear Logic,
Please clarify your meaning in referring to lawyers as the Banks’ brothers as Outfit guys.
I can tell you Aiuppa’s ancestry. He was Melroseparkian (LOL). Two of his lesser known nicknames were: “deuce deuce” or “two-two” because he was from the 22nd St. area in Melrose Park.
No need to trace is ancestry back any further than that.
Giancana and Accardo were both Sicilian.
Albert Tocco was only part Greek; he has mainly Italian. He was also “made.”
Gussie Alex was never “made” but didn’t need to be. As Joe has stated, being “made” wasn’t always necessary for a person to be a successful gangster.
Thanks Potato! Ricca was Napoli like Capone..I think that the Napoli connection to the Cammora is why the Outfit was always close with the Genovese NY mob. Johnny Torrio was from that region where the Rotti/Caruso’s are from and I wouldn’t be suprised if Bruno Roti was brought to Chicago by Torrio, just like Capone. I think having both Sicilians,Southern Italians and Jewish members helped make the Outfit become so strong nation wide The Outfit could form bonds with gangsters in other cities no matter where they were from. Another reason that italian criminal enterprises are dying off in America is because these criminal syndicates form out of the mass immigration experience which Italians are no longer a part of. Hell, talk to northern italians about who the gangsters are in northern Italy. The criminal gangs in Northern Italy are Albanians. Sorry, my interest is in the history and not so much in these guys who are left. Your sight is fantastic! thanks Joe!
Al Tocco’s parents were both Abruzzese, no Greek.
Interesting to see a lack of Elmwood Park Outfit guys at the Prince of Bridgeport’s wedding on Saturday…wonder if its because they aren’t as close to the Carusos anymore or whether they don’t attend weddings for the FBI scrutiny. Would have thought at least DiFronzo would attend the wedding of the son of one of his major Capo’s.
Dear Logic,
Caruso is not one of DiFronzo’s major Capo’s.
Joe–who else would be running chinatown? Father–Sammy I was there, didnt see Jimmy.
Dear Logic,
Are you referring to the ownership of the poker machines in Chinatown?
Sammy I is no more a gangster than Cerone-esq. This I know as a fact and naming guys like him as gangsters is were your source (burnstein) looses all credibility. Sammy I’s father and father in law are gangsters but he is not.
Was Jimmy I there?
I can probably do some of the others, too. I’d need a day or so. I’m certain that the Calabrese’s were not Sicilian. I need to check where they’re from.
Lombardo and the Spilotro’s were from the general Bari region of Italy (near-tip of “the boot,” on the side facing the Mediterranean Sea), which is where a lot of non-Sicilian East Coast mobsters claim to be from, as well.
The Roti’s and Caruso’s claim ancestory from Simbario, Italy.
It’s Calabria-ish in its geography; ie, tip of the boot and very close to Sicily. They’re all members of the Saint Rocco Society. Google it for more information.
Dear Readers,
The Cerone family would probably doubt the article that I authored above. One big reason would be that John DiFronzo made it a practice to visit Clara Cerone (late wife of the late gangster Jack) on Christmas Day every year and this meeting sometimes took place at her son’s house. I witnessed it personally one year when I was at the Cerone house in Barrington, Illinois (the home of Jack Esq.).
DiFronzo told me personally that he continued doing it until only a couple of years prior to her death. DiFronzo told me that Clara was spending Christmas in Florida, and he had no other reason to visit the Cerone house but to see her. Since she was indisposed a couple of years prior to her passing, DiFronzo discontinued his visits. I believe DiFronzo told me that he did go to her wake. Keep in mind that he did not go to Jack’s wake in 1996. Most people believe it was to avoid scrutiny. On the contrary, I believe it stemmed from many years of dislike for gangster-Cerone and his spoiled brat of a son.
Nonetheless, DiFronzo certainly does not pay respect at the Cerone house any longer. Like Johnny DiFronzo, the only Cerone that I will always love is Clara (nee) Russo.
Did you get some feedback about this article from Cerone or one his associates through some back channel or something?
Dear Bub,
I am merely well aware of their arrogance and simply know what to expect from them. I thought I should address their supposed response for the readers to understand both sides. Thank you.
One of Nicholas Pileggi’s sources is quoted as recalling an intoxicated Jackie “the Lackey” Cerone grabbing a female patron by the arm and commanding her to perform fellatio on him in the presence of Mad Sam DeStefano at a tavern on Manheim Road. (This is in the book, Casino.)
I hope you agree that this is a very disturbing scenario, indeed.
What I can’t get my head around is how Joe Batters would stand for this. He and Aiuppa had a strict edict against drunkenness that applied to all members of the Outfit. It seems very risk and extremely reckless for Cerone to behave in that manner in public where anyone could have sent word over to Accardo.
I’m not going to pretend I’ve never been drunk before, but a person would have to be pretty touched in the head to accost another person like that (in full public view) and issue such a disgusting demand.
Joe, the worst part about it is when she refused he allegedly slapped her and proceeded to “run her outta the joint.” This is very upsetting.
Do you know of any similar stories? It would be interesting to open up such a discussion.
Dear Dino,
Truthfully, I have a hard time believing the story. The part that he was taking advantage of a woman is hard to swallow. Unless it was his girlfriend, then I could possibly see it – if he was extremely drunk. However, it all being done in public make me disagree with it. Not that Jack was one to never misbehave in public, but he was not known to be a sex offender.
As for any stories that I might have about public intoxication relating to Jack Cerone (the gangster), I have a couple that I will share.
One night (about 30-years ago), Jack was out late by himself having a drink in Elmwood Park, Illinois, at a little gin-mill on Deversy. Apparently, the new bartender did not know Jack, coupled with the fact that Jack did not regularly patronize the place. As it was after last call, Jack asked for drink – the bartender said no. Jack was immediately outraged and decided to pick up a glass from the bar and throw it at the mirror above the back bar shattering glass everywhere. He screamed at the bartender commanding him that he will have another drink or else. The bartender panicked and called the Elmwood Park Police (in those days it was one of the most corrupt police stations in the world). Sure enough, an Outfit friendly police officer took the call, which could have been any of the officers in the entire building. The bartender did not know Jack’s name, however the description fit. The friendly officer immediately realized it was Jack and did the only thing an Elmwood Park Police officer would do – he got a hold of Joey A and Johnny D informing them of Jack’s situation. Of course, Joey A and Johnny immediately arrived at the bar. The bartender knew Joey and Johnny thinking they might have came to help him. They asked the bartender what the problem was and he pointed at Jack and said it started with that man (pointing at Jack) demanding a drink after last call. Johnny and Joey told the bartender that he better give the man a drink. At that second, everything made sense to the bartender as he started to turn white. I do not believe anything bad happened to the bartender, other than he likely had to serve Jack until 5am while being called names the entire time.
One last story.
It was at Jackie the lawyer’s annual golf outing dinner. And it was about 26 years ago. Jackie the attorney did something to instigate his father, which was a common practice. It caused his father to have a conversation with then Teamsters Official Dominic Senese. All of a sudden loud shouting could be heard through the entire dining room of roughly 200-dinner guests. Rants such as I will shoot you in your head were heard. Willie Messino (who was asked by Joey O to keep an eye on Jack’s drinking) ran over to Jack and Dominic. Willie cleverly interrupted Jack by telling him he had an important phone call. Jack stopped his yelling and walked away with Willie. On the way to the phone room, Willie told Jack that there was no phone call and that he simply broke up a conversation that could be heard by everyone. Jack immediately started screaming at Willie, telling Willie that he was the boss and not him. And he will shout at anyone he wants to and say anything he wants to say.
The next morning Willie reported this to Joey O. Joey O thanked Willie. I have no idea what was done about it after that.
You see, in most cases, no one ever reported anything about Jack to his bosses. And in the rare occasion they did, the bosses would decide either not to believe it or give Jack a pass. Not as much as 1% of jack’s episodes ever made it back to his bosses; therefore, he skated by without being noticed. I felt for Willie. His job was very dangerous. He was fortunate to die of natural causes. Keeping an eye on jack could prove to be deadly. However, Willie was smart enough to know that if he were going to take an order it would be Joey O’s orders to take over Jack’s.
SOME of Tocco’s GRANDparents were Italians. I’m fairy certain that he had some (perhaps negligible) amount of Greek heritage via his parents. Also, he had personal contacts in Greece, which is why he fled there in the late-80’s.
ALL of Tocco’s grandparents were Italian, from the old country. His parents were American born. He had absolutely NO Greek heritage. I don’t know who came up with that.
Is it true that Aiuppa was known as Deuce-Deuce? I’ve heard that before.
Dear UIC,
Personally, I have only heard him referred to as Joey O by some of his closest and oldest friends.
I am sorry, Jack used to refer to Aiuppa as the ‘Fisherman’.
Dear Joe,
Was the Cerone-Accardo relationship similar to the Magnafichi-Cerone relationship?
It seems that there are very few people who liked Jackie Cerone, and Aiuppa seems to have a better legacy. Even though he wasn’t bright (per reputation), Aiuppa was a feared and effective leader.
I find it difficult to believe that someone as supposedly decent as Mike Magnafichi would’ve maintained any degree of admiration or friendship with Cerone.
Dear Mo,
Good comparison. Yes, the Magnafichi-Cerone relationship was very similar to Cerone-Accardo, in way.
Joe this obit. is interesting:
http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2002-11-27/news/0211270166_1_mob-enforcer-boss
It says, though, that Willie was an adviser to Marco D’Amico. Why does Marco get so much attention?
The part about, “He drove one of his grandsons to school each day and was a fixture at Little League baseball games” was very touching.
It’s hard to believe that he was capable of violence, as well.
Dear Mo,
That obituary was incorrect in almost everything it said, with the exception of driving his grandson and being a fixture at little league baseball (and going to prison). In fact, Willie hated Marco.
All is quiet in DuPage County, eh? No news about Rudy Fratto?
Dear William,
Rudy recently traveled downstate to be with his son at school for an afternoon. Aside from that, so far, he is scheduled to go to prison on September 7, 2010. We will see.
hey joe why u always talkin about guys who are dead how about those alive that are hurting people. did you ever look into a guy by the name of pete labellestra,hes a scumbag been selling dope for years never been arrested i wonder how many favors he did for the f.b.i.We should guys off the street like him but we cant because the federal govt needs scum like him.
Dear Larry,
DiFronzo, Giacchino, Fratto and Scavo are not dead; I talk about them a lot. Anyway, I would be glad to exploit other bad people, dead or alive. Send me some facts on the subject. I will gladly look into it. My email address is jfosco@americannewspost.com.
joe he was the guy that channel 9 did a special on about 7 yrs ago.It was making of a mobster. There was romanian kid that used to push dope for him that was featured on show, hes deported now. pete is not american citizen why dont you ask around who this charachter is.Why dont you ask your contacts and the fbi
Dear Larry,
I do not have contacts with the FBI. I will check with some other sources.
Joe, did you’re dad know Sam Giancana? If so, were there any fond memories of him?
Dear Barnacle,
Yes, my father knew Sam Giancana. My father was with Teets from the 1940’s until Teets went to prison in the 1960’s. I am unaware of any stories about Mooney from my father. My father did not tell stories about those people. The only thing I remember my father telling me about Mooney is that he was a family man (this was an answer to a question I asked of my father). I believe that was his way of curbing my curiosity. I have a couple of Mooney stories thru some other friends of my father.
I’d love to hear any stories about Mooney.
I read this thing a while back about how Mooney was a “pious” mobster. He was somehow able to compartmentalize his life to such an extent that he allowed himself to engage in utterly evil behavior as a “businessman,” but as family man, he cultivated an Old World, overtly Catholic “culture” in the homestead. All of the womanizing and so on was precipitated by the death of his wife, Angeline.
[Spilotro, too, was said to have religious preoccupations. In Vegas he supposedly tried to convert one of his girlfriends (who was a Mormon) to Catholicism. He’d leave missals and holy cards laying around her condo.]
Dear Barnacle,
Perhaps I will do a piece on Mooney. Personally, I think he was the best Outfit boss next to Al Capone.
Not Accardo who ruled for 50 years and never spent a night in prison? Have to shun the limelight to be successful and that was Sam’s downfall.
Dear Logic,
Accardo did not do half the things that Giancana did. Giancana’s downfall was losing his guardian angel, which was not his fault.
I would have to disagree with you on this, Mr.Fosco, I believe Accardo was the best of the best! Mooney may have moved the Outfit into more modern ventures of the time, but it was only with the approval of Joe Batters, who is second to only Snorky, in my humble opinion!!
Dear Ugotz,
Joe B’s (Accardo) boss was Paul Ricca. Ricca is the one to credit, not Joe. Ricca loved Mooney.
Your dad was in Teets’ crew?
Dear Stronz,
Yes, most definitely.
Do you know if your Dad was made? If not, did he have that option? If your Dad was with Teets, I hope you realize that he was probably in a position to stomp some serious ass in his day. (No offense.)
Dear Danny,
I have learned that my father was someone that did awful things to people (physically) when he was a young man, working for Teets. That was not the man I knew. I knew a gentle and loving person with a great sense of humor. He was a suit and tie union official that went to work every day and came home every night. My father was in his early 50’s when I was born. Therefore, his life was completely different, for the better, when he fathered me, apposed to my older half-brothers that he had when he was in his twenties. The only person that I know of that actually said that my father was ‘made’ was Joe Ferriola. I have no idea if it is true or not. Whatever he was, he was out of the bad part of it before my birth.
How do you know that Ferriola said your dad was made, and what were the circumstances of you finding this out?
Dear Danny,
Joe’s son-in-law worked for my father as a union trustee. The son-in-law told me that Joe told him several years earlier that my father was ‘made’ and used to be a hitman in the 1950’s. There was a similar story that I heard from another source.
Getting back to Joe’s son-in-law. When my father was made the boss of the union, Joe’s son-in-law asked Joe who my father was (wondering why my father got the promotion instead of him). That is when Joe told him that my father was ‘made’. Perhaps Joe simply lied to his son-in-law to quiet him down about not getting the promotion.
If Joe Nick told someone that your Dad was made, then he probably was. I’m sure if that wasn’t true, and word got out that Joe was telling people that, there would have been problems.
Dear Danny,
You could be right.
Dina’s husband? How come handsome Mike never tried to date her…I hear she’s doing well as a real estate agent.
HOLD ON! Back up. Why would Mike M. date Dina’s husband? What kind of sick thing is that to say?
Joe, I’m interested in hearing some of the stories you know about Sam Giancana.
Dom,
I know some interesting stories that Willie Messino told me. However, I would rather put them in an article. Willie disliked Mooney, as did the rest of Jack’s crew. My late father was a Giancana loyalist. However, Willie briefly swayed me to believe that Giancana was a bad boss. However, my friend Buddy Ciotti helped me come to my final determination, which is that Giancana was perhaps the best boss Chicago ever had.
Interesting. I will be looking forward to that article.
Hey Joe,
Check out this link, which features DiFronzo. (I wonder what he would think about this.)
Man, that drum machine and wicked guitar riff in the background are pretty awesome, don’t you agree? (LOL)
Dear Stronz,
The link did not come thru.
Joe–
These stories are phenomenal and much appreciated. Wondering whether you could provide a few examples of your nightlife hangouts when you ran with Magnifichi and crew…did you ever frequent Jilly’s on Rush Street or Richards on Grand Ave.? Those are two of the few places still around today where you will see these guys.
Dear Logic,
I ran with, Messino, Ciotti, Cerone (Esq.), Colucci, Dominic, Giacchino, Daddono and Magnafichi. In all my years on the scene, I have been to Jilly’s less than 10-times. Too many car salesmen in that place.
Richards Bar is one place that I spent time. I have been there probably 500-times. There are some interesting people there.
it sounds to me joe you likeds hanging around dees guys.Then you bad mouth difronzo,the cassano brothers and pudgy mattassa, you dont like guys who will stand up to you.Joe dont get me wrong what you are doing is great but everyone of those outfit guys are fair game.in my opinion sometimes it looks like you only talk about guys you dont like,or the ones who are easy to write about. why dont you go looking for the sleepers. ive told you who they are.Follow the big moneyjoe and you will see.
Dear Larry,
Once upon a time, I did foolishly enjoy hanging out with those guys. Politicos, judges, police chiefs and many others did too. However, unlike politicos, judges and police chiefs, I have taken a stance against the bad guys. I write about the people that I have knowledge of engaging in wrongdoing. As for the sleepers, I know of more sleepers than you do. I believe I have enough enemies to worry about right now. Awaking any sleepers would only put my life in further danger.
nobody is asking for you to awaken anyone there here infront of everybodiesnoses.Joe no one underestimates that you no more sleepers or people than i do but you sure do have abigger audience than most of us.You could relly do good work and get this bad people put away with all the resources you have.I didnt mean to sound rude but come on joe there may be alittle of truth what i said.Love your work joe sometimes we need to get out of our comfort box thanx joe.P.S check out those guys who reside in marco island,Florida or have there second homes there.
Dear Joe,
Larry on a Dime’s comments are off-base. “Follow the money” and you’ll “see?”
What, does he think he’s in the CIA? All the Presidents men?
Joe, I think you do a fine job, but it would be nice if, once in a while, you narrowed your scope and wrote specifically about a particular mobster or corrupt person, the way you used to do with Fratto and still do with Giacchino. (In my opinion, both of those stories are old news–except in the event that Rudy cooperates. It’s been mentioned before, but you should do an exposé on the late-Lee Mags, your dad, etc.
Dear Readers,
Jackie Cerone (Esq.) used to host a golfing event via his social club UNICO for many years. For most of the years, the event was held at St Andrews in West Chicago. Jackie managed to pull in hundreds of guests every year – no doubt on his father’s coattails. However, he maintained his high numbers of guests for several years after his father’s death. Earlier this month, Jackie’s golf outing hit a record low of 40-guests.
Michael Magnafichi recently told me that he could put 40-golfers together to play on any given Sunday – as we both laughed.
Dear Joe,
Could you fill us in on the story about Esq. allegedly telling you that he was his father’s underboss? (Please note that this claim is contrary to information from any and all law enforcement agency in the country.)
I think that this would make an interesting conversation–if not article–because of the fact that there would be some seriously troubling legal implications for Esq. if that were true. John “Jackie The Lackey” Cerone (1914 – 1996) was certainly responsible for murders, and as you know, there is no statute of limitations on first degree murder.Could such charges be extended to someone who was complicit in first degree murder (e.g., planning, advising, etc.) even if he or she is not the one who pulled the trigger? Please comment.
Thank you.
Dear Mabeline,
Based on what Jackie told me, that he was his fathers underboss is very troubling. Yes, that would make him an accessory to almost every crime committed by his father under RICO. The government could go back and get him; they could tie him to murder conspiracies the same way it was done in Family Secrets. I believe he instigated the hit against Dorfman and Senese, and probably many others. However, one small problem, my word alone that he said what he said is not going to cut it. And, if I had a tape recording of his confession, he could simply say that he lied when told me that. In other words, unless Rudy Fratto corroborates my statement, Jack Esq. will continue to live the life of Riley ($$$).
Joe
F**k these last few comments about the past , I forgot everyone is perfect ….!!! My question to you is how much do you think ESQ got when the old man died ??? Must be nice just to get it handed to you instead of being a real man and working for it and doing it on your own or at least be humble
Dear Tom,
Some of the old mans closest friends that knew him better than most, thought that he was worth anywhere from 25-35 million in cash, and another million or so on paper. As close as I was to Esq, I would say that he might have made that much himself, however on the coattails of his father. That is counting all the union business that he hogged for a couple of decades. And the roughly 10-million bucks he screwed his partners out of from Brookwood Country Club. And, the million or so he swindled from Paul Jr. I could keep going. And I am not adding the money he took from me.
I have heard people suggest that the old man was worth hundreds of millions. Trust me it is not true. Twenty-five to 35-million is it. You have to remember what money was valued at 40 and 50 years ago. Do not take me wrong, I wish someone was handing me 25-million bucks today.
I can add this, in all the years I was around Esq (roughly 7), he never had anything but ancient one-hundred dollar bills in his pocket, as well as his son, and they spent a lot of money with no end to those bills. I am sure he is still spending them.
When the old man died, he instructed Esq to give everyone of his grandchildren 1-million dollars (unfortunately that did not include Esq’s sister Jill’s kids). And Esq’s wife inherited 500K. Esq’s son enjoyed his cut by spending it – he was 24 when he collected it. The rest of them had to give it back when Esq was caught cheating on his wife. All the kids took their mothers side, upsetting Esq to the point that he called it all in. The idiots gave it to him.
That’s right; Judge Jill Cerone-Marisie probably did not pay inheritance tax on her million. Good thing, because she lost it a few years later.
OK, who is Paul Jr?
Also, did the Lawyer’s Kid side with his mother?
Dear moose,
Paul Ricca’s son. Yes, the kid sided with his mom – they all did.
What line of work is Paul Jr. in? It’s legitimate, I’m assuming.
Dear Moose,
Paul is retired.
Joe
Not bad 25-30 million for doing nothing except being esq , there no reason the screw people out of $$$ at the golf course . Next questions Johnny & Greedy how much you think there worth & throw Joey A
In there ??? One more thing like it’s esq kids fault that he got caught cheating those are still your kids there should be a reason to chose sides…!!! Remember you don’t see a brinks truck follow in a funeral
Dear Tom,
When you count Johnny’s money, you have to count the value of D&P because he certainly has hidden interest in the company. Sources of mine would suggest that Johnny is sitting on somewhere around 20-million. Petie is probably around the same ballpark, only because of his wife’s ownership in D&P. Joey A (he does have property), could be worth as much as 10-million.
DiFronzo has gotta be 20-mil in property alone. Chrissakes, Aruba and all that has gotta be another 20.
Joe, do you know if Cicero and the other thugs and streets hustlers kick up to him, or does he let them keep their $?
Dear Stronzo,
You could be right. But I do not think the figures are higher than your projection. I doubt DiFronzo wants anything from Cicero. I know he was getting an of Ciotti and DeVita’s racket. But not as much as you would think. They may have kicked him a couple of hundred thousand at the end of the year. Had Cerone and Aiuppa avoided prison, they would have demanded the king’s ransom. Johnny wanted to be so far away from things in Chicago that he was happy to get a couple of hundred grand a year – if that much. Of course, I am merely speaking about Melrose, Stone Park, and the surrounding towns (poker machine business).
Everyone makes the mistake of believing these guys have tens of millions of dollars. They are wealthy, and they achieved it the dishonest way, but they are not the kings that the media and government makes them out to be.
Joe–
I would assume like other families, the Outfit is still very structured and the boss gets a piece of everything.
I’ve heard DiFronzo has hidden interests in Perillo and Al Piemonte car dealerships. In fact didn’t he retain an office in one of these dealerships in the late 1980s?
He also owns significant land up and down Grand Avenue and has lived rather humbly in the same place for years.
One thing I thought was interesting from hearing the Calabrese tapes from prison is Frank discussing DiFronzo’s net worth and telling his son how Johnny encouraged his Elmwood Park crew to invest in legitimate businesses and even provided advice and opportunities for them to do so. Calabrese’s boss on the other hand, LaPietra, discouraged his men from investing legitimately and tried to keep them focused on the streets. Strange difference between Chinatown and Elmwood Park Crews. Whats your take?
Dear Logic,
Johnny is a smart man that realized the Outfit was not going to last forever, which is why he concentrated on legitimate business and property investments. Other gangsters cannot see the big picture. I think if Johnny had started out legit, he would have been a CEO of a major corporation. However, he still managed to do pretty well for being a psychopathic killer/gangster.
Joe small type o meant shouldn’t not should
Why do you think everyone is so obsessed with sleepers, Joe?
Has anyone ever considered the fact that there’s not so much sleepers as there are those who just stay the hell away from the Outfit because it’s a floundering organization?
What is this obsession with sleepers? I have trouble believing they actually exist to the extent that others on here do.
Dear Stronzo,
I am not obsessed with sleepers. Others who are obsessed are probably curious.
Dear Joe,
How much do u estimate mags to be worth?
Also, I think you stated earlier that elmwood park has been clear of outfit business for years. Interesting . . . but what exactly do you mean by this? In the past you’ve likened this town to places like melrose park and bridgeport. In your opinion, which places are still full of outfit activity. I would be surprised if elmwood park did not make ur list.
Lastly, even though I know you were never a ‘made guy,’ I just wanted to know if, at times, if you ever miss ‘the life?’
Dear Gnocchi,
I estimate Mags to be worth – well- lets put it this way, at one time, he was worth nearly one-million dollars. Today, I have no idea what he might have left.
The way to judge if whether a town is ‘Outfit’ or not is by whether poker machines exist. Elmwood Park outlawed those years ago. Now that does not mean bookies are not operating out of the town with cell phones, but that does not count. They are usually mobile and could be in one place today and another place tomorrow. Poker machines exist mostly in the southern Cook County areas now.
Not only was I not ever a ‘made guy’ I was not even one-million miles within the scope of being ‘made’. There is ‘nothing’, I repeat ‘nothing’ I miss about being in that circle of life. If I wanted it, I could have easily kept it. I blew it off, which ignited the turmoil that plagued me, causing the matters that led up to why I had to file a civil RICO complaint against my former associates. Until the day I die, I will live with the regret of making the inappropriate decisions of associating with people my father would have disowned me for knowing. Despite my father’s involvement with the Outfit, he would have never approved of me associating with any of them. I brought a great deal of grief to my loved ones over my inappropriate decisions to mingle with such a bad bunch. I pray to God that I could one day right the wrongs that my actions have caused for some of my loved ones.
joe, i’m noticing a financial theme here. interesting.
how much is rudy worth? (seriously)
Dear Bill,
Rudy has nothing.
Dear Bill,
In fact, Rudy’s greed caused his parents to file bankruptcy in the early 2000’s. And he almost caused the same exact trouble for some of my relatives. Rudy’s greed has no bounds.
Well, Darien IL isn’t cheap, and all those years of bid rigging and racketeering and his wife’s travel agency must have yielded something. That’s why I asked, I guess.
Dear Bill,
He lived beyond his means to live in Darien. He financially drained scores of people to live in Darien. He committed egregious crimes to live in Darien. Yes, you are correct, Darien isn’t cheap. Again, Rudy has nothing. He is moving out of his home that he cannot afford.
Interesting you say he has no money. Didn’t the Perfect Pasta and other extortion bring him close to a million dollars? I pretty sure that’s what it said in the paper.
Dear Bill,
I have no doubts that Rudy acquired a million bucks in his lifetime, I am sure he made much more than that. I have been projecting my assessment of what these people are worth. There is a difference. The money that Rudy made was used to cover his living expenses, which is why he is broke. He simply did not make enough to be rich, or to have a few bucks. DiFronzo, Cerone, and some of the others managed to become rich – not poor Rudy.
The million bucks Rudy supposedly made (relating to his tax case) occurred over nearly a 10-year span. That comes out to 2-grand a week. Try living like a millionaire (or a real mob boss) on 2-grand a week (whether you pay taxes or not) and see what you have left in the end.
I see.
Implied in all of this is the fact that Mrs. Fratto’s travel agency (which for a while had some online information) wasn’t kicking some major ass, financially, either?
I’m trying to figure out why, in the 21st century, someone would be willing to commit “egregious crimes” and risk a lengthy prison term to live as a gangster/mobster/mafioso for 2 GRAND A WEEK!!! (Most school teachers I know make that much.) Had he stuck with a career as an electrician, as you’ve said on here, he would’ve probably done far better.
Dear Bill,
There is something about the lifestyle of a gangster that draws a number of people in. It had an effect on me for a longtime. And, as I said, look at the politicos, judges and police chiefs over the years that gravitated to it. Perhaps it is in the upbringing. Italian-Americans that were raised by Capone era parents in the Chicago land area might have been inadvertently conditioned to view gangsters as idols and not the despicable form of life that they are. Rudy had some real life gangster uncles that probably made a lot of money, which could have been a motivating factor for Rudy to hang up his electrical tape and pipe bender. He became a real gangster. As it turns out, he is a gangster without money and the manly ability to serve prison time. Yes, he should have stuck to electrical work. He would be retiring right now with a pension and 401k that would have probably made him a millionaire. Instead, he spends his days cooking up new schemes with his attorneys (that obviously have a lot of time on their hands) to convince his judges to delay his surrender date.
joe its not the upbringing of the italian americans that your stating.Its just like the hispanics blacks have there gangs.Sometimes you just feel like your a family,have importance. whoever tells you thats not the start of it all, there lying.Then comes the money and the hustling,but it starts as a family thing first.Just like you joe with your dad,you saw him when you were growing up being a part of something and you wanted that also,so stop your whining putting blame on others.Still love your work joe.Dont forget about the people i mentioned before in other post,very interesting charachters and im not c.i.a. just a realist,someone who knows somethings
Dear Larry,
My father’s run with Teets was long over when I knew my dad. The man that I knew as a father was suit wearing union official that had a secretary and drove I nice car. My father never told me about his Outfit connections. I did not know what the Outfit was when my father was alive. In fact, like Rudy, my father was a liar. However, they told different kinds of lies. Rudy told everyone he was an Outfit boss. My father told everyone he was a former insurance sales clerk that wound up a union official. The truth is that my father did something for the Outfit to receive a six-figure a year job as a union boss when he clearly lacked the necessary background. These are things I learned after my fathers passing. Some of the people around my father that knew more than I did were the ones that told me about my father. Again, the man I knew as a father was a man that had a good sense of humor that loved my younger brother and me very much. He taught me the importance of a good education. He did not fill my head with Outfit stories. In fact, he would have no respect for any man that would expose his own children to such information. My problem came via my environment. The Elmwood Park area is what caused me to notice Outfit stuff. Unfortunately, I was not willing to follow my father’s advice by educating myself. Instead, I involved myself in the wrong crowd. I did this because other children that I spent time with had fathers like Rudy that told their little kids big exciting stories about the Outfit. I was misguided and without a father – who was dead by my 14th year. Again, I decided to take up an interest in Outfit nonsense. When I learned that my father was involved in this cool and exciting thing, I was drawn to it more. In a confused and misguided way, I believed I was honoring my late father’s memory by going off in a direction that I believed he traveled. Never once did I consider what he was trying to teach me, that education was the answer. I threw my life away on this crap. If it’s the last thing I do, I am going to make a difference by catching some young misguided kids attention that might be thinking about becoming a gangster (or a wannabe like I was) and turn him around. I hope.
Dear “larry:”
Please take my advice and proofread what you write before you click the “submit” button. Some of what you say is interesting; unfortunately, a lot of it is indecipherable, as well. Please do not take offense to what I’m saying.
Dear Joe,
I’m noticing something of a strange theme revolving around this “‘Fat’ Victor Stramaglio” person that logic has brought about several times on your last couple Outfit threads.
Let’s hope this isn’t going to turn into another Nick Gio-situation, if you know what I mean.
Do you remember the commenter named “!” who posted that all that sensational stuff about Esq, Esq’s kid (woof! woof! woof! pssssss) and DiFronzo? You considered him or her to be mostly credible. Did you ever find out who was behind those remarks?
Well, if “!” is reading this now, maybe he or she would like to grace us with his or her presence again by dropping a few more bombshells on us.
Dear bebop,
I certainly remember ‘!’. No, I have no clue who ‘!’ is.
Joe–
Have a question for you…I’d heard once that a lot of Outfit guys had minor roles in some B movie in the early 90s…I believe Rudy, Mike Talerico and a few others. Probably something Gino Credidio and his brother was behind. Know anything about that?
Dear Logic,
I do not know off hand. I will check it out. Nothing would surprise me with Rudy. Rudy is the Ralph Kramdon of the Outfit, always cooking up a harebrain scheme that never goes too far. Six-years ago he was attempting to reach R Kelly while Kelly was spending a great deal of time in Chicago over his sex case. Rudy was pawning himself off as a Rap-singers agent. The singer is actually a Fratto – some young kid. Unfortunately for the kid, Rudy’s silly attempt failed.
Back to bid rigging and extortion.
Thanks Joe…Rudy sounds like a nightmare.
Joe,
You mentioned on another thread that Rocky Infelise was not well liked by Jacks crew, but was in the social circle do to his wife Anne. What was Rocky’s relationship like with Johnny and Joe A specifically?
Dear Father,
Rocky’s nickname amongst Jack’s crew was the ‘Huck’ (possibly derived from the word ‘huckster’). The crew did not hate him; obviously, they used him as a boss. However, it was well known that Jack favored him because of Anne. Let me clarify my earlier statement about Rocky. Its not that Jack’s crew hated him, they actually liked him, but silently held it against him that his popularity was not genuine, it came thru his wife because of her closeness to Jack.
All right, I will drop a bombshell right now (Anne please forgive me); Anne was one of Jack’s mistresses. Until today, less than 5-people knew about this. And Rocky was not one of them.
Now do you get my meaning? How do you take a man serious when you know he was made boss because of who is wife is sleeping with?
John and Joey A were very close with Rocky.
Is Anne still alive?
Dear XXX,
I believe she is still alive. Last time I saw her, she told me she is living in Downers Grove, Illinois.
I sure hope Mr. Infelice is ready for this. This is going to cause some serious issue in the marriage and in the Outfit.
Thank you.
Dear XXX,
Mr. Infelice is dead.
Joe Nick was also close with Rocky right?
Bombshell indeed…sleeping with another made man’s wife…thats grounds for a hit and surprised that Accardo and Aiuppa didn’t have him hit for that.
Dear Mario,
I am not sure Auippa knew about it. I am certain that Accordo did not know. Cerone and Anne were close way before she ever met Rocky. Anne’s father was Jack’s boss – Tony Cap – Cap brought Cerone into the picture back in the day Cerone was a card dealer at the old Rock Gardens in Cicero, Illinois.
Anne is not the only wife that Jack used to sleep with.
Rocky had another wife before Anne, maybe they set him up with Anne because he was an up and comer and earner, from what I know Rocky earned his own share of respect and his crew was earning in the 80’s and 90’s
Dear Father,
You might be right. Anne was married at least one time prior to Rocky as well. She was married to a Marino.
Joe–
You rarely write about the guys from the South Side probably because you grew up in Elmwood, but curious about what you do know. Did any of the guys you ran with ever have dealings down there?
I grew up hearing about Johnny Apes Monteleone, the LaPietra brothers and Frank Furio. I believe that Angelo LaPietra was rather high up at one point right? Can you shed any light on what Cerone/Joey A/Turk or Aiuppa thought of Angelo? Seemed like a psychopath from what I heard in Family Secrets.
Also, what about Johnny Apes who probably reported to DiFronzo before he died. Was DiFronzo close with Apes or anyone in the Chinatown crew?
I had heard rumors that when Angelo came back from prison in the mid 90s…he was mental. I used to have a card game at the club on Sheilds and he would be there, but no one wanted to talk to him because he might flip out. Heard DiFronzo and Jonny Apes wouldn’t have anything to do with him.
Dear Logic,
Apes was boss for a while, before Cicero took it. Difronzo and Andriacchi were certainly compatible with Apes. I remember back in late 1996, when Apes was the boss, my friend George Colucci was in the midst of leaving his partnership with Jack Cerone, Esq in their venture called Grand Wood Corporation, aka Colucci’s Restaurant and/or II Jack’s Italian Restaurant.
Jack was trying to deprive George of his fair share by not giving him the correct amount in buying out George. It was actually a crime what Jack wanted to pay George. First George asked Willie Messino to talk to Johnny for some help. Johnny refused to get involved. Then George asked Michael Magnafichi to talk to Joey A for help. Joey told George, thru Michael, to go see Apes and that Apes will take care of it. Sure enough, George met with Apes. Apes whistled in Jackie and told him to give George the right figure. And it was done.
LaPietra was a Capo. He hated Jack Esquire too. I will brush up my LaPietra studies and get back to you.
Thanks for the background Joe. Did you ever know Aldo, Shorty LaMantia’s adopted son or Riche The Cat?
Dear Logic,
I did not know LaMantia. I have seen The Cat around over the years. He never impressed me.
Frank Calabrese shared a hot dog cart/stand with John DiFronzo. That’s not a lie. So, yeah, there’s one connection between Elmwood Pk and the South Side.
Logic and some of you others seem to be really proud of the fact that you live in Chicago–or so you claim.
So you know, Chicago hasn’t been considered a significant area of mob activity since the 1970’s. BOSTON was a greater cause for concern for the federal government in the 80’s, for crying out loud.
New York, Philly, the rest of New England, then, maybe, Chicago.
@ sheamus you must be an expert. Boston was a concern because Bulger killed without regard and was a snitch. The Philly mob are a bunch a goons not too bright, but in Chicago we got nothing going on. They just found 3/4 million cash in frank sr. house and he has been locked up for 10 years and he was a soldier and an idiot. who you crappin?
Who are YOU crappin? The Outfit gave up its Commission seat when Giancana was exiled. It is an interesting subject, but you all are blowing it waaaaaaaaaaaaaay out of proportion.
Why are you here reading this website then? This is more like gossip for me…I knew some of these guys and enjoy the background and side stories from Joe…if you don’t like reading it:
MOVE ON.
The FBI invested millions in time and taxpayer dollars on Family Secrets…they don’t invest that time and money in two-bit operations.
The interesting thing about Chicago is the tradition. You can trace the guys still involved today back to Capone, Giancanna, Arcado. Comparing Chicago to Boston’s stupid mob is like comparing Rome to Iowa City.
Seamus, Chicago is and always will be considered a powerhouse in regards to many things, so do some research, maybe one of the reasons you feel that way is because of the lack of RATS in the Windy City, don’t judge due to lack of publicity/court trials and media attention.
Ugotz472,
You’re missing the point. The Outfit is an interesting phenomenon that will only ever be a footnote in history. You are sick for lionizing organized crime.
Ugotz472,
Don’t brag about the lack of “rats” in Chicago. You are referring to people who are doing the right thing by cooperating with the government–people who have decided what is right instead of what is evil and wrong.
You have a sick mind, do you know that? You need to get your priorities straight.
Joe, please keep an eye on this guy, Ugotz472, who is praising the organization who put a contract out on your life. He is bragging about the Outfit, for all the world to read. This is sick, sick behavior. Please keep and eye on this and take action if necessary.
Thank you
The Outfit also isn’t an Italian-American organization to the same extent as New York, Philly, Boston, NE, or even Cleveland. Not even close.
Arguably, it’s not even a “mafia.”
Accardo used the word “paisans” as a pejorative when referring to the eastern bosses. Accardo and Giancana both hated the induction ceremony, and it wasn’t used in the Outfit until Aiuppa was at the helm. (They thought it was silly nonsense.)
That’s wrong. The Outfit only “made” Italian members, the vast majority of their members are Italian, the boss has always been Italian and they were branded as La Cosa Nostra since the beginning.
There isn’t as much known about the Outfit as other families because only one made-member has flipped and that didn’t happen until 2006. Previous to Nick’s testimony and Frank C’s recording, no one (including the FBI) even knew whether the Outfit conducted the traditional ceremony.
Chicago was present at Appalachin and they worked with the Genovese family to control the teamsters and have had operations throughout the country with other families.
I would suggest you read Angelo Lonardo’s testimony from the 1980s about how things worked with Chicago and New York. Since he was boss of Cleveland, Lonardo reported to both Aiuppa and Fat Tony Salerno.
Dear Little Al,
Your mention of Tony Salerno and the Teamsters reminds me of Jackie Presser. I remember an oil painting being delivered to my father in the mid 1980’s. Jackie Presser sent it. It was of Jackie Presser and he signed it. My older brother has it now (who would want it?). What was interesting to me was Jackie Presser made several flattering attempts to get close to my father. In one instance, Jackie called my dad to see if he was going to Vegas for some union convention – my dad told him “no,” and Jackie told my father, “if your not going, I’m not going.” Not quite longer than a year of my fathers passing it came out that Jackie was a double agent, working for the Justice Department. All I could think was Jackie targeted my father as one of his pawns to hand over to the government. I do not believe my father was doing anything wrong. Although, he had an interesting group of employees under him, such as Joe Ferriola’s son-in-law, Paul Ricca’s nephew, Pat Marcy’s brother and of course Jack Esq was the union’s attorney.
I never knew this stuff when my father was alive.
Pat Marcy’s brother? Interesting…was his last name also Marcy or the original Italian monicker? Also was Ferriola’s son in law Crudele, husband of his daughter?
Nick Ferriola seems to parallel you to a certian extent in the respect that his father died when he was young and I’m sure Nick wanted that life. Unfortunatley for Nick, he didn’t wise up like you did.
Dear Little Al,
Pat’s brother was Paul Marcy. The Ferriola’s son-in-law that worked for my father was married to daughter Darlene.
You’re wrong.
Giancana and Accardo spoke derisively of the induction ceremony, and the FBI has reported that Outfit members were “made” with a handshake and stern lecture from the boss, sometimes followed by dinner or a party–a “reception” if you will.
There was nothing Old World or overtly Italian about it.
Warmbir or another journalist associated with the Suntimes asserted that the East Coast induction model was implemented in Chicago in the 1980’s at the suggestion of Carlisi or someone.
The government classified the Outfit as LCN because it functions as a traditional organized criminal entity. “Traditional” is not synonymous with “Italian;” it refers to traditional rackets, which were also practiced by Jews, Russian, and Irish criminals.
Get your head out of the clouds.
Name one non-Italian overall boss of the Chicago Outfit. Name one non-Italian made member confirmed by the FBI. Ask yourself why, the vast majority of these stories focus on Italians (including Joe).
Sorry Charlie–Joe would probably happy to confirm that indeed, the Outfit is La Cosa Nostra.
While guys like Murray Humphreys, Gus Alex and Lenny Patrick had higher status than they probably would in other families, overall, they always reported to Italians.
Name one traditional Outfit induction ceremony prior to 1983. You can’t because it never occurred, and it has nothing to do with Nick Calabrese being the first made guy to flip. The initiation rites of the Eastern families were the source of much ridicule by the Chicago bosses. Mooney especially considered it a kid’s game.
I’m not disputing that it’s classified as LCN by the government. What I’m saying is that it’s a different animal than “the mafia.”
The Five Families, Philadelphia, Patriarca that’s the mafia.
The Outfit is something else that’s not necessarily essentially Italian. The Outfit is a gang that participates in traditional rackets.
Why is this a sore subject?
Oh, and another major difference is that the Outfit is not a Sicilian organization. Into the 80’s the Eastern Families had Sicilians in their ranks, and to this day they import Sicilian contract killers (‘zips’). Those guys can still be heard conversing in the Old language.
The Outfit is a EOE street gang that has had Italians in their hierarchy do to their merit and capability–not necessarily because they are Italian.
Accardo had no particular love or trust of Italians.
Joe you want to clear this up for this confused reader?
I can’t talk about a prior induction ceremony because there is no information available on it. Again, Nick Calabrese is the only made-member to flip on the Outfit in their entire history and unfortunately, he’s just not old enough.
So because Moony considered the induction ceremony a kids game and Chicago made fun of it, it means the Outfit wasn’t La Cosa Nostra? Why was he in constant communication with East Coast bosses like Tommy Brown? Why did Accardo invite Joe Profaci, Patriarca, Genovese, and other bosses from around the country to his daughter’s wedding? Why did they all attend?
I ask you again, at Appalachin, did they ask bonified EOE street gangs (as you refer to it as) to attend? Well then why did Chicago attend?
At its height, the Mafia included 26 cities idiot. The 5 families, Philly, New England, Pittsburgh, Tampa, San Francisco, LA, Chicago, Kansas City, New Orleans etc…was never just an east coast thing…started there, but the Italian criminal elements like the black hand, etc. eventually united under one flag and that was la cosa nostra.
La Cosa Nostra was originated by Sicilians, but later included all Italians. Many US mafia families retain ties to Neopolitan mafia clans and many US LCN members are Neopolitan including John Gotti and Rusty Rastelli.
You need to get a little better history before making statements…you won’t look like such an idiot.
Nice try though 🙂
LOL, fighting over whether or not the Outfit is LCN…LOL, name-calling…
Why does anyone care unless you’re in the Outfit, right Joe? I highly doubt that Tony, Little Mikey, or Pudgey Matassa are posting in these comments LOL LOL LOL
(those MOTHERS!)
Joe, what’s the status of getting the felonies removed from your record? (Little Jackie – LOL — that MOTHER!)
Dear Mr. Jingle,
I have completely defocused from that matter. I have been very busy with other things this summer. However, I have recently told one of my attorneys that we need to get the ball rolling soon. In part, I have not focused on the matter because I am told that it will be corrected as soon as I do something about it, which will be soon. This is not a case where a defendant was found guilty of a felony and is trying to get a pardon. It is strictly an information error that needs to come off. I was not convicted of a felony or a misdemeanor in the case Cerone lodged against me 5-years ago. Again, the courthouse reported incorrect information to the State of Illinois. I might file a lawsuit against the Cook County Sheriffs office and Judge Cerone-Marisie. Again, I will keep you posted.
I will keep you posted. Thanks for thinking of me.
Stop reading Roemer’s books. The making ceremony was way back in the 1930’s and 1940’s in Chicago. IT WAS NEVER A HANDSHAKE. Chicago has had high ranking non Italian associates as partners just like New York who had Meyer Lansky, Bugsy Siegel etc. The only made members of the Chicago Oufit are Italian american or Italians born in Italy. No different than New York in this regard.
This is wrong. Jake “Greasy Thumb” Guzik was not Italian but was a member of the Chicago Outfit.
Dear Joe,
It seems to me that some of the people on here are defending the reputation and legacy of the Chicago mob. For instance, one person sarcastically stated, “but in Chicago we got nothing going on,” implying that the extent of mob activity in Chicago rivals that of the real Italian mafia in New York (Bonanno, Lucchese, Columbo, etc., etc.).
Why would someone be so sensitive about the Outfit? Why would anyone WANT there to be an Outfit?
Dear Merrie,
I believe the people that want an Outfit to exist are sadly conditioned that way from birth. In some cases, I think that it is more of a hobby for them. Sort of like an infatuation with Cowboys and Indians. I can understand the infatuation with the history of the Outfit. The Outfit was a very impressive organization, though not for positive reasons. However, I cannot understand why anyone would want it to exist today. The Outfit represents murder and mayhem.
Dear Ms. Querfurth, It isn’t a question of defending the existence or want it. Sheamus made the statement that Chicago’s outfit was smaller than Boston and New England and his statement was wrong, he also wondered like you why we seemed to take pride in Chicago. I am from Chicago and believe it is the best city in the U.S. for many reasons, but part of our history is organized crime, and unfortunately our criminals have been extremely successful at their enterprise. I do not take “pride” in that but I do enjoy uncovering from the shadows the people involved in this history. I am proud to be from Chicago and I understand the reach of the criminal enterprise the outfit, because I have lived around it all my life. I do not agree with their choices and understand that they have released havoc and misery on many, but these criminals and there existence is interesting to some and this site gives us an outlet to share what we know and get the truth out there. The Federal Government and the mainstream press in my opinion get more wrong than right involving organized crime and this site and Joe particularly shed a lot of light on the subject.
Thank you,
Father Guido
Man, Logic really takes this to heart. LOL
Yes, it is a sore subject for a few people on here. If you criticize the Outfit or take a shot at its “stature” they got their panties all knotted up in a bunch. Careful, pretty soon Logic will be calling you a “spaccone” without realizing what he’s saying. Logic seems to know a lot about how to fake being Italian–renting Casino, getting Olive garden carryout, and so on (LOL). I think he is just describing his own embarrassing behavior.
You need to get a little better history before making statements…you won’t look like such an idiot.
Nice try though 🙂
LOL 😉
“Tommy Brown” — LOL!
Wow, Logic, I didn’t know you’re so familiar with these guys. 😉
Joe, you have misspelled Gerry Carusiello’s first and last name several times throughout various threads on this site and in the article related to this thread. Jerry Carsello is not how it’s spelled.
Dear Frank,
I admit that I have not verified the spelling of his name. I have been spelling it the way it sounds. However, can you show me some solid evidence as to the correct spelling? I would be glad to make any necessary corrections.
Dear Frank,
I have checked it out. I believe that I have the first name spelled correctly – Jerry. The last name is likely spelled as you have it – Carusiello. Thank you for your help. I will make the necessary correction in the article.
His first name was Gerald, hence Gerry, not Jerry. Of course, it can be spelled as Jerry, but that’d be a little unusual for someone named Gerald to not go by Gerry but Jerry. For example, Joseph Scalise’s middle name is Jerome, which is why he goes by Jerry, not Gerry. And, yes, Carusiello is the correct spelling.
Dear 123,
Thank you for the lesson; however, what evidence do you have that supports your claim that Jerry spelled his first name with a ‘G’? I checked his Social Security record, which indicates his name as Jerry. I have noticed that other websites have stated his name as ‘Gerald’ or ‘Gerry’; however, unless you can furnish some solid evidence, I am going to side with the Social Security Administration. I could ask one of his relatives that I know, but I am comfortable with my findings via the Social Security Administration for now.
I don’t put much stock into what is written on websites. As for his correct name, FBI reports going back to the late 1960s spell it as Gerald Carusiello, as do court documents and newspaper articles going back that far. According to FBI and court records, his full name was Gerald Joseph Carusiello; some news articles have included his middle initial (Gerald J. Carusiello) since newspapers rarely spell out middle names and typically use middle initials in order to save space. As for the online Social Security Death Index, it has more than a few first names and last names I have looked up over the years spelled wrong. Ancestry.com maintains that online database, not the Social Security office. So chalk it up to clerical errors.
Dear 123,
Would you consider furnishing me with a copy of some of this official documentation proving the correct spelling of Jerry’s name? Perhaps if I knew your identity I would not be reluctant to take you at your word.
http://bulk.resource.org/courts.gov/c/F2/426/426.F2d.868.28785.28818.html
There’s a link to a court document (an appeal in a robbery case) concerning Carusiello. He got 15 years in that case and served a good chunk of it down in Florida. It seems he was in Miami a lot in the 1960s. He was rousted at least once down there in 1964 with Frank “Lefty” Rosenthal, who was living in Miami at the time before relocating to Las Vegas.
Dear 123,
It appears Jerry’s legal name is Gerald, thank you. However, a number of sources have told me he used the name Jerry. My friend Jerry Navarro does the same thing.
Wait a minute. Are you telling us that Armando Jr. took money for the groceries? (If so, then he must not have attended Catholic school.) One time you have alluded to Armando’s age and appearance (weight), and, to be frank with you, I couldn’t believe what I was reading.
Joe, which brothers are you close with? I’m assuming that you’re out with Armando and Paul, but that Ralph is your full brother whom your close with.
Hopefully other readers will see that real family is what is important–not “Outfit family” which some seem to be longing for. That is SICK!
Dear Christina,
No. Not Armando Junior – a family named ‘Andrews’. Harry Andrews. His son Denis owns a popular maintenance service in the Chicago area. It was once named Steam Pro (or something like that). When Uncle Romie became senile, the Andrews got very close to him. I discovered something was wrong when I dropped off a carton of cigarettes for Aunt Maryon and was handed a personal check for $350.00. I asked what it was for, and they said “the cigarettes.” My response was ‘what do you mean, first I do not want any money whatsoever, and secondly, cigarettes do not cost more than $40.00.” Aunt Maryon indicated that Harry told them cigarettes cost $350.00. After a further review, I discovered that Harry and Denis were trying to barrow $50,000.00 from them – to help grow Steam Pro (a service company that does not require assets or large holdings). The Andrews were banished from the house. Harry Andrews was not the only person to steal from the Nappi’s. Their friend and attorney (now disbarred) Nick Spina was caught with his hand in the cookie jar before he was banished from their residence. Luck for these people the Nappi’s never pressed charges. However, their banker was very helpful in proving to the family that Spina was a crook.
If you do not mind, I would rather keep the status of my relations with my various brothers off the threads. If it has come up before, what is done is done, however, my position now is to not comment. Thank you.
Frankly, the behavior you have described is SICK. I hope others such as Logic will agree instead of being impressed with the scams that were perpetrated against this elderly couple because it is similar to what the Chicago Outfit would do.
Mob worship and fetishism is deplorable.
Constantly attacking one person because you disagree with his political beliefs is deplorable. Logic has stated numerous times that he grew up in a mob neighborhood and looks at this forum more as gossip and intrigue on people he actually grew up hearing about.
He’s also stated that he’s seen mob violence and the terrible things they do up close (unlike you.) So please move on.
Logic is a fountain of misinformation in all matters regarding organized crime, politics and Italian slang. Yes, his understanding of the way things work is very peculiar, indeed.
Joe,
Do you know what I find interesting? That apparently when the mob thought Calabrese was going to flip, they were still only giving him the equivalent of $40K a year. At least according to Family Secrets, his brother hadn’t shared much prior to that either.
Is that normal in the Outfit? It seems crazy that they wouldn’t take better care of someone who, to quote Casino, could “sink the whole world.” They are all sitting on 10s of millions but being unbelievably cheap with this guy who did all the dirty work. Is that because they thought the threat of being killed himself would suffice to keep him quiet?
Dear Nick,
Yes, it is normal behavior for the millionaire bosses to not help the smaller guys that could flip and put everyone away. I have to say that I understand it. If they sent a message that people could squeeze them for money, they would not have their money for long.
Gotcha. That is interesting. That never occurred to me.
yes, the outfit is a bad organization. no arguments from me.
listen, i know a lot of italians are in the construction/contracting industry, so i was wondering if maybe someone could answer a question for me:
i’m trying to remove a wall-mounted mirror that the previous owner adhered with EPOXY. (i’m not kidding.) how the hell do i get this thing off? demolish the entire wall???!!!
Joe, can you do an article about how the outfit and difronzo are able to this day exercise control over towns like cicero and melrose park, even with federal law enforcement watching these towns closely. Larry Dominick and Serpico are connected by association to the oufit they succesfully spin these associations as non-existent, but they are there. why else would you allow open sex and gambling businesses to operate in your town? i will include Topolowski of McCook, and who ever is mayor of Chicago Hts. Heck Daley is guilty too in my opinion. These quasi legit business are allowed because the money generated allows these guys (the mayors) to run hispanic centric “social programs and festivals to stay elected for life or indictment. And connected guys make money both on and off the books. Please continue to out players like Scavo and the idiot in des plaines.
Dear Father,
I do not think writing an article is necessary. The answer is simple. The Ronny Serpico’s of the world are terrorists. Any political leader that makes the decision to seek advice from a gangster or issue a gangster a favor is simply a terrorist.
Fat Vic Stramaglio, ha! ha! (that MOTHER!)
Just worry about yourself, Mr. Logic, and leave Fat Vic outta this.
Tell ’em, Joe. The Outfit is as dead as a doornail. You’re probably right about the corruption thing. There’ll always be a layer of corruption from people with Italian last names. If people who have seen too many movies wanna call them the Outfit, so be it.
LOL, Solly-D! (that MOTHER!)
I’m not sure why, but I think I agree with this post by Jingledonkey.
Whats Jingledonkey’s obsession with Fat Vic and trying to slam Logic? Seems like a bonified troll if you ask me.
Joe–
Were you ever close to the Cozzo family? I ask because I believe Phil would be near your age and curious as to whether you think Philly might be made. Also, did you ever attend their summer BBQ’s?
Maybe one of 5 houses in the city of Chicago with a pool lol…has to be against code yet there it still is.
Speaking of Grand Avenue…what is your take on Perry Mandera? I believe he’s seen success in his new trucking business and now has positioned himself as a local philanthropist. Sponsors the Jessie White Tumbling team among others. Do you think he’s changed his ways since the days of running strip clubs or do you think he retains ongoing relationship with the mob?
Dear Logic,
I was not close to the Cozzo family. However, I believe that I know enough to say with certainty that Phil is not ‘made’. And, I am aware of the unusual Cozzo compound on Ogden Ave.
I am sorry to say that I have no take on Perry Mandera whatsoever. Thank you.
logic,dont the manderas own blacjacks in west suburb.I forget the name of town.That owner there is a wacko i heard.Joe this should interest you,rudy fratto used to go in there alot.The owner used to pay him every month for protection up until MR.fratto got into trouble,i knew you would enjoy that one.Rudy used to go on trips with owner of blk jks to costa rica maybe rudy liked young girls,dont know just asking.Also whos that big fat guy that hangs around marco damico.There always at gratto on ,friday nite on the terrace.Smoking big fat cigars you should go there ona thur or fri nite.You could do alot of research there
Dear Larry,
I know all about Rudy’s dealings with the Buttita’s at Black Jack’s. Its old news. Yes, if were not for Black Jack’s, Rudy would have had to use call-girl services all these years. Rudy used to have many places on the arm. He had the victims believing it was Johnny DiFronzo making him do it, which is not the case and never was.
Readers,
I would like to say that ‘Buttita’ is just about the most unfortunate surname I have ever come across. Pardon me for using the following sexy swear words, but it contains both the words “butt” and “tit.”
Whoever the clown was at Ellis Island who is responsible for this one likely scarred several generations of this family.
Thank you.
Hey Joe I bet Jack Sr didn’t fly commercial home from jail in July 1996.
Dear Joe,
Now that we have this Logic person goofing off in the threads, it really makes me miss Harlem Playboy. His insistence on returning to this “fringe player” theme (Victor Stramaglio, Joe Belli, and company) is really getting out of control and is far more annoying than anything Harlem was responsible for. Even when you shoot down his theories, Logic keeps it up, which creates chaos and obscures what should be a normal, loose and easy Q & A type of format.
Dear Harlem,
I, for one, would like to see you return to the threads. Your old contributions were funny and interesting. Speaking for myself, I will not give you a hard time or bring up you-know-who. Please believe me.
I look forward to your return.
Here here!!!
When an outfit guy like Jerry Scalise is arrested, does he get help from the Outfit or are they on their own?
Dear Marie,
Jerry is not a ‘made’ guy; in fact, he is on his own. However, when Outfit guys are indicted, some get help and some do not. Usually its their crew that helps. It depends on many variables. Some crews do not have the money to be helpful. The ones that do will help if the they were a part of the conspiracy associated with the indictment.
Back in 1989, B.J. Jahoda taped Rocky Infelise saying he was in charge of what he called “the nut,” which was money that went to guys in prison who were part of the Cicero group. At the time, he said “the nut” was $35,000 a month. Infelise told Jahoda that Scalise, who was then in prison in England for the Marlborough diamond heist and part of the Cicero group, was getting $2,000 a month. But, that was then, this is now, and I bet he’s getting nothing now.
Dear 123,
Rocky used to tell lies all the time about how much money he was helping people with. Ask Joe Ferriola’s widow how helpful Rocky was with money. If she were not afraid of him, he would have been indicted on home invasion right after Joe died. Rocky walked into Ferriola’s house as if he owned it before Joe’s body was cold. He pulled Joe’s safe out of the house. There are many other instances that support my claim that Rocky told many lies when it came to money.
That’s well-known about Infelise taking the money out of Ferriola’s secret basement safe. It came out at the Infelise trial. However, that was Outfit money, not Joe Ferriola’s money. He was the Cicero group’s bank; he held their bankroll for gambling, which also came out at the trial. When Ferriola died, it went to Infelise because that money belonged to the Outfit. Had he not taken it, the FBI would have taken it just like they did Frank Calabrese’s secret stash. They had a search warrant for Ferriola’s basement and found the secret safe, but it was empty. It the same as when a mob loanshark dies and his book is given to another crew member. And Infelise didn’t pull the safe out. The FBI found the safe during the raid over a year later. Which tells you he had the combination because Ferriola gave it to him.
Dear 123,
It is a story I heard as a teenage over 20-years ago. Thank you for your input. Do you have the transcripts of the case it came out in?
Was Rocky a WW2 vet? I read somewhere that he was supposedly a para-trooper any truth to this!
Dear Ugotz,
I have no idea.
How would Scalise not be made? He’s been a major hitter for decades and usually, hitters are made guys. He’s also served long bits in the can. He is also the last survivor of the wild bunch crew along with Jimmy Inendino. I like others in the neighborhood were surprised to see his name as we thought he was long-retired after his latest pinch…but would have to believe Scalise is made.
Dear Serrantino,
My opinion is based on the various conversations I have had with Outfit hierarchy over the years. Either one of us could be wrong.
I believe the news report said he was a “member” of the Outfit and its particularly wily hitsquad, the WIldbunch. Then again, news reports have been saying that Marco D’Amico is not only made–but a high ranking capo or boss.
He may be rough and “active,” but he’s supposedly pretty low on the totem pole. Right, Joe?
Dear Barnyard,
The news is usually wrong about Outfit stuff. However, Bill Romer was the most misinformed person on the outfit. As I implied before, Scalise was not an intricate member of the Outfit.
Understand but I know enough to come to the conclusion there are two types of made guys–hitters–who are made because they do a lot of hits and thus have to be trusted and earners–and guys who become boss. I know for a fact that Eugene Spazziri is made and he and the guy’s brother are both hitters. Not the smartest in the bunch, but mean guys who know how to break legs and put a guy in the trunk….and have been for decades…the guy has a few things here and there to make his money…ownerships, etc. then when Elmwood Park calls him to take someone out, he steps up.
Always assumed Scalise was exactly like the Spizziri’s…Scalise also goes back to the 60s…came up on Taylor Street and got his start under Jimmy The Bomber. From there seemed like the guy was always a floater…reporting to Angelo LaPietra or Rocky Infelise…certain hitters were used by all crews right Joe? Jerry was never a fringe player…he was usually in the center of things if he wasn’t in jail. I heard he got into gardening while in the can in Britain and owns florist shops in the suburbs.
Dear Serrantino,
There is another Scalise, not related to Jerry, Sponge. And was in Johnny’s crew. Yes, several crews use some of the same hit men. That is the bosses call. All it really means is the boss has more confidence in the traveling hit man than he does in the killers belonging to the crew.
The Spilotro hit was something that Ferriola played a big roll in orchestrating. I believe he called in every capable person he trusted. Johnny was there to see it happen.
Serrantino,
This quote of yours is outrageous: “then when Elmwood Park calls him to take someone out, he steps up.”
What are you talking about? You can’t just say something like that and not explain it. There hasn’t been an Outfit murder since Zizzo and that was an anomalie. Prior to that was Chiaramonti–and he was almost 10-years ago now.
Face it. The Outfit isn’t what it used to be. It doesn’t still kill people. It’s on it’s way out.
Scalise may or may not be made, but he certainly is connected to the outfit. I am sure Aleman wasn’t “made” It doesnt matter unless your going to be a capo or boss. Scalise was taken care of on the london time because it was a sponsered job, just like Aleman was. Its more to keep payments to family are to keep guys quiet not because of some honor bullsh..t I would think guys on the street who can be tied to RICO by scalise would help with the bills, like Marcello did for Nick C, although that didn’t work out so well. LOL.
Another reader chimed in on the “connected guy” vs the “made guy” Its not only a Chicago thing if you saw the movie Goodfella’s you understand they operate the same way out East. It comes down to money and greed at the end of the day, not ethnic heritage and secret society membership.
Joe,
On August 31, 2010 at 12:06 pm, “Serrantino” said:
—
” I know for a fact that Eugene Spazziri is made and he and the guy’s brother are both hitters. ”
—
This is a very serious statement of fact. If it is false, this commenter is going to be held liable. How do you suppose someone can make a statement like this without explaining it or citing sources?
Thank you.
Joe, wouldn’t these three face some kinda sanctions/punishment for actually casing the LaPietra house and trying to rob it??
I understand that LaPietra is gone, but isn’t there anyone around who if this would have gone down, would have been upset??
Dear Ugotz,
After Jackie Esq swindled Paul Ricca’s son, the bosses passed a rule that from that point forward, bosses widows and children would be protected from extortionist and thieves. Good question. Yes, according to the rules, the trio’s lives should now be in danger. However, I would not be surprised if the bosses today no longer care about such rules. In theory, they should, or else what peace of mind do they take to their graves leaving their fortune, children, and widows behind as fair game for any ruthless thug to come and take away their money.
Joe,
You have to do something about the current format here. I love ANP but can’t stand the delay period after we submit comments.
Hi Joe,
You’re a real soldier and I respect what you’re doing.
M
Dear Marty,
Thank you.
hey joe do you ever go to gratto or gibson on a thur fri nite. Some interesting guys there,marco damico with some guy who calls himself “moe”has a body shop in maywood,did you ever think of doing any research there.I would like to know how all dis guys special treatment and why,its not because they tip good either there very cheap.Also do you kniw owner of volare benny,he just got bailed out of his rest.in chicago (has 2 locations 1 in chic.n 1 in oakbrook) by a guy by the name eddie greco.This guy has a big food distribution comp.About twenty yrs ago he used to hang around witha a guy by the name ray di selvestro, ray lives in vegas. was a known member of the outfit.Check them 2 out and let us know what you think joe.You may just find out what organized crime looks like and what its developed into.Ray was on chic.crime comission chart.Do you know him logic? YOU know alot about elmwood park crew>
Dear Larry,
I have been to Benny’s restaurants numerous times over the years (both in the city and in suburb). I have spies that keep me informed on who goes in there. I know Benny. I remember when he worked for Joey A. Benny is an Outfit groupie, which is why he kisses Marco’s a**.
I know Ray the cop. I have not seen him since he moved to Vegas approximately 18-years ago.
Dear Larry,
Furthermore, the body shop owner is nothing but a slave for Marco. Imagine how many dents a drunk like Marco winds up getting on his car, though, he uses a driver more so these days. If you dented your car as much as he does, you would have your body shop person with you too.
The more I think about it, the more I realize that Joe “the Shark” Lopez was right when he said that the Outfit is dead. “Who’s left? A couple of bookies?”
Dear Scuba,
As long as Johnny DiFronzo and some of his killers are alive, the Outfit has life in it.
Well, John DiFronzo is in his eighties and will be dead or in prison someday soon. The Outfit isn’t going to resort to murders in this day and age. (Yes, I am aware of Zizzo.) Especially with the monstrous RICO case the G is mounting against its remaining house of cards “leadership.” Do you disagree?
Dear Scuba,
I believe that Johnny is very cautious, but not incapable.
Right, and when he’s gone, which will be sooner than later, that will be it. Marcello is in prison. Sarno is going to prison. Fratto is going to prison. Andriacchi is dying. Who’s left? Toots? Marco? Peter DiFronzo? Sol C? I bet all are targets in the G’s next case.
The Outfit is done. You’re living proof.
Dear Scuba,
I am proof the Outfit is done getting caught. They are using me to make the argument that it is done – Johnny is just that smart. I am inadvertently helping him make his argument. I am surprised no one has wrongly accused me of secretly aiding the Outfit in a master scheme to make them look like powerless fools.
Joe, maybe I’m off base here, but I think that our various police agencies could be doing more to bring down the last of the extremely crippled, barely-existent Chicago Outfit.
First, they need to have the courage to fire their corrupt officers the same way Mexico just terminated the employment of >3000 corrupt officers who were protecting/acquiescing to their OC groups.
Then, they should do what Jody Weis just did with the street gangs: Sit down with the leaders and put the fear of God (RICO) into them.
This will draw them to a state of (near) inactivity. Then, it will only be a matter of time before the FBI hands down its indictments.
The End.
Don’t say it can’t be done. Berwyn and Cicero have fired officers who were mob associates within the past 18 months. Melrose Park would be a little more difficult, I admit. After all, it’s the town that Joey O’Brien built.
But never say never.
Dear Barnyard,
I think the State of Illinois should be dissolved and eliminated from the United States all together – the state that Al Capone built. Indiana and Wisconsin could be expanded to make up for the uncharted space.
Most of the police officials in the Chicago area will not entertain doing what Jody Weiss has done recently because they idolize the Outfit.
The State of Illinois needs to implement a vetting process for all state authorized police agencies as strict as what the FBI and CIA uses. However, the police unions would likely prevent such process from costing existing officers their jobs. One way around it would be to remove these existing officers from their positions of power; however, they would have to keep their current salary amount in order to please the union.
Do you agree with Weis’ approach?
A pair of aldermen are accusing him of negotiating with terrorists.
I don’t think that’s the case because he basically told the gang leaders that from this day forth, the CPD is going to come down on gangs with every tool in their tool box if the killing continues. Supposedly this approach has worked in other gang-laden major cities.
Weis has been accused of being a coward and has even been censured by the FOP. But I think his approach here is a good one.
Dear Barn,
The FBI used to stuff like that with the Outfit. To me it raises two interesting theory’s. One, the criminal could conclude that law enforcement has nothing on them; otherwise they would simply arrest them. Two, if law enforcement does have a case against them, why would Weis give them a pass for now? Threats of any kind (or warnings) are dumb. Put up or shit up.
So what do you think it is? Has CPD lost control of the streets? That seems to be the conclusion, according to your analysis. There is no logical reason why the CPD would give a pass to leaders now if they do indeed have a case.
Dear Barn,
CPD has control over things, they send $100.00 tickets out to drivers that touch the white line, turn right on red when permitted, or are stuck in an intersection while the light changes. Then try to park the car, see what that entails, credit cards, bags of change, etcetera.
Joe–
The recent news about Nick Boscarino’s brother is interesting…are you aware of the Boscarino’s or know some further info on the hit that killed their father in the 1960s? Believe their father was known as “the barber” and lived near Taylor.
Dear Logic,
I have met Nick a number of times. I believe that he is an innocent person. And, I know who his father was. He has a stepbrother on the Rosemont Police Department.
The Outfit tried to extort Nick in the late 1980’s and he threatened to go to the FBI – he was left alone ever since.
Good insight…wonder if he saw Peter DiFronzo around in Barrington at all?
Nick was directly involved in that casino deal in Elgin right? The Salamones are bad characters…especially Vito…and he was hooked up with them…can’t dispute that.
Dear Logic,
Nick was involved in the casino deal, but I forgot the details. I do not know much about the Salamone’s but I am aware of them.
They owned Gianottis for years. Word is the guy who owns Baci pizza parlors fell into Vito for serious cash…so he allowed Vito’s son to open a Baci’s franchise down at his college in Peoria which is a major hit there.
I wouldn’t doubt Vito being a made member given his juice loan business, and his brother an associate.
That’s actually “Bacci’s” the famous place outside Wrigley. Joe do you have any inside scoop on that story? Does it hold water or just BS?
Dear Logic,
I am not clear on what story you are talking about.
Thanks anyway…I’m sure you are familiar with the old Gianotti’s though right? Any inside info you have on either Salamone would be appreciated.
Angelo Boscarino the father of Anthony and Nick was found in a garbage bag on the southwest side, I have read he was murdered by Frank “the German” Schweis and it had something to do with a bank robbery in Schiller Park in the 60’s. Another guy was shot in Stone Park as a result of the same robbery.
Dear Joe,
There’s been a lot of drivel on here about the Outfit’s national standing and status in relation to La Cosa Nostra, which it is not. I suppose it’s “the mob,” but it’s not the mafia. It’s not Sicilian–the essential criteria.
To be sure, the Outfit has usually been run by an executive board of individuals, most–but not all–of who are of Italian heritage. Colisimo was not a mafioso–he was an extortionist who had a multi-ethnic gang. This gang was the antecedent to the Capone gang and the Outfit. Capone would have traded every Italian in his organization for another Guzik (Polish) or Murray Humphreys (Welsh). He didn’t care about ethnicity–with the exception of Sicilians. He HATED Sicilians. (As we know, La Cosa Nostra, proper, was started by Sicilian immigrants.) Accardo would have traded every Italian in this organized for another Gus Alex (Greek). Accardo had no love for people from the Old Country.
Now, look: It’s clear that the Outfit is different, in kind, from the mafia, which operates in most major cities other than Chicago. Admittedly, the Outfit operates in a similar fashion–that is it has its hand in the same rackets. It is organized similarly, as well; although, it has far fewer “made” men. In fact, soldiers aren’t “made” in the Outfit–at least not anymore. The reason that only one “made” member has flipped is because there aren’t that many actual “made” members—not because they took and Oath and are great at being “in the shadows.”
I don’t know why people have such a hard time accepting this–even if they’re in the Outfit. This is not a personal attack on anyone. I merely state long-established facts. I can’t understand why someone with no affiliation with the Outfit allows his feelings to be hurt to the extent that he results to name-calling to defend the honor and reputation of the Outfit.
Why does the assertion, “The Outfit is not the same thing as the East Coast Mafia,” hurt some people’s feelings? This is baffling.
It seems to me that we’re dealing with people who watch mob movies and TV shows and read mob books, and live in a “dream world” in which they are in the Outfit. They’re clearly nostalgic for the 50’s, 60’s, 70’s, and 80’s when “made guys” ran “street crews” and “whacked/clipped” “rats” and “snitches,” and periodically gathered at restaurants on “Mang-heim” for “making” ceremonies, and flew out to New York to have a “sit-down” with the other “bosses” on the “Commission.” Frankly, it’s disturbing to see grown adults reacting and behaving in this way.
The Outfit is an interesting subject, as a matter of local HISTORICAL intrigue. But wondering if “Richie the Cat” and “Fat Victor” are “made,” or who are the “hitters” (LOL) and “sleepers” in the non-existent “Elmwood Park Street Crew” is a waste of time.
Dear Outfit,
First, Accardo would have liked another Sammy Alex (Gussie’s brother) and Sammy’s boss (who I will write about soon) more than another Gussie. He did love Gussie though.
The ‘Cat’ wishes he were ‘made’. I will double check on Victor, but I do not think he is made.
You are talking about me right? Apparently we can use this forum to vent about things that annoy us?
Yet why become annoyed by something so easily avoidable? Here are a few simple steps at avoiding what you’ve just vented a full essay on:
1. When you get to one of my comments, simply keep scrolling down to the next one. I had been doing that for your comments, but couldn’t resist mocking you here.
2. When deciding your online reading material, perhaps realiize that a forum devoted from a guy who writes on the Outfit might not be the best for someone such as yourself, who is obviously so upset at the thought of people discussing well…the Outfit.
3. This is the last time I respond to you…keep making comments about “things that annoy you” and it will be your own time that you are wasting…not mine…I will begin scrolling right past your comments again.
Have a nice day! Do smiley faces annoy you as much as Outfit talk? If so…scroll down fast…this is a fair warning…I’ve included one here:
🙂
Richie “the Cat” passed away a couple of months ago.
Dear Nicky,
Its funny you mentioned that. I was asking someone about him this morning and the person asked me if he was still alive. I did not hear he died until just now.
YES!!!
The Italian American Mafia is just what it stands for ‘Italian American’. The Sicilian Mafia is Sicilian. They are two different organizations. John Gotti, from New York, was born and raised in America. He belonged to the New York Mafia which is Italian American. His parents came from Naples.
Do you know anything about a Flower Shop Jerry Scalise owns in the suburbs?
Dear Marie,
I do not know anything about the flower shop. However, I further researched Jerry and learned from one of my reliable sources that it is highly likely that he was ‘made’ many years ago thru Joey O. Apparently, Joey O liked him very much and used him for setting up major projects. Actually, Jerry belonged to Infelise; however, Joey O would have his way with him quite a bit. The question is whom could he be ‘with’ now since Infelise and Joey O are dead. Here is where my earlier opinion becomes relevant – he is on his own. ‘Made’ or not, he is alone. There have been plenty of ‘made’ guys out there that were later considered zeros because their bosses died and they were not well known to the new bosses. However, in my own opinion, I suppose it is possible the Cicero guys could have been working with him in some way, since they have proven they are fearless enough to work with anyone for money.
I am on the fence over jerry’s case. As much as I believe that he deserves a bond according to his charges, I do believe that he will disappear as soon as he is released.
Supposedly, he’s not supposed to be communicating with James Inendino, so maybe he’s “with” Inendino.
Dear Outfit,
Almost anything is possible.
Jerry also got busted selling cocaine in the late 90s…just a few years after being released in London. I think he pissed a lot of people in the Outfit off with that, given he was told to stay low (this was after the Bobby Cruz murder whose body was found a few hundred yards from Scalise’s house).
I would agree with Joe that the guy is on his own these days…its likely that Jimmy I needed a few reliable burglars for the LaPietra break-in and no one is better than those three. They probably just needed the cash.
Joe, you mentioned that Aiuppa used Scalise for setting up major projects. Can you elaborate?
Dear Tony,
I am looking into it.
i can’t help but think of difronzo and andriacchi as historical figures. at the time of the family secrets trial the fbi was asked if they were aware of difronzo’s whereabouts. they said “no” because difronzo wasn’t known to be engaging in any criminal activity whatsoever at the time. he was not a matter of concern.
funny that difronzo and little al tornabene were originally intended to be targets in family secrets, but the government didn’t have enough on them. andriacchi was not a target, which, to me, makes me think that he was out of it before difronzo.
these guys are historical figures–perhaps chicago’s last true link to the accardo-age.
sure, frank caruso and fratto were alive then, but they didn’t have–and don’t have now–anywhere near the stature of difronzo and andriacchi.
Dear Bort,
I agree.
I’ve been following the Outfit pretty intensely for a very long time and I also agree. After DiFronzo and Andriacchi die, there will be no one of interest left–besides Lombardo and Marcello, both in prison for life. They are the only ones you can kind of find intriguing. They came from the old world when it was just a different thing. I can see how if you were dirt poor growing up in the ghetto back then you might get caught up in this. But the vast majority of guys involved today just seem like your average two-bit low life losers.
Dear Mark,
Great comment.
Joe, Logic & Readers,
Please examine this webpage closely. Can you believe who they have running this place? Joe, please do a public service announcement about this. This really is beyond the pale.
http://pappadeaux.com/location/?id=32
Dear Outfit,
Who is he?
Is that the Michael Spano who went down with Betty Loren Maltese is the Cicero case?
Dear Outfit,
I know Michael very well; it sure does not look like him (the father or the son). Unless his looks changed drastically, I would have to say it is a different Spano – this kid looks like a baby.
Dear Outfit Alert,
And if it were Michael Spano, which it is not (the Maltese co-defendant), I would not do a public announcement on him for this reason. Spano paid his debt to society; he is not a sex offender working near children. No reason to exploit.
dear logic,joe fosco: first of all the salamones names are vito and joe.Joe is the worst of the two and vito is agreat guy.He will help you if you need help.They associate him wiyth outfit cause his family is very well connected in sicily. He has helped many bus. men by borrowing them money>Now if these guy cant repay the loan he becmes partners at least he lets you keepit not like the banks they take it away and your living in the street.Now i know your saying how much is juicing these guys its not crazy trust me sometimes in the real world (corporate)especially today you cant get aloan from atraditional bank so you need independeent investors is what they call themselves.Now he helped this one guy out that he should never did,gigi rovito from capri in burr ridge.ThaT GUY THERE DID I THINK 8 to 10 yrs in jail for rape. Hes a scumbag you can check that out joe he also hangs around with wannabe gangster jerry demarco from demarcos rest.Sometimes vito puts himself with real stupid people,maybe thats because vito is short and he feels taller that way.Joe check out he has with that eddie greco imentioned to you before youll see this greco guy is like an octopuss hes into everything.
Dear Larry,
I am well aware of the details you have shared. However, I am not interested in anyone of those people.
Thanks.
Interesting background Larry’s…I mainly only know of them through their ownership of the original Gianotti’s in Norridge.
Joe Greco is a longtime Outfit member who used to be under Solano way back when right?
Joe–Vince Solano was such a major stature in the Outfit that seemed to easily cruise under the radar. Any backstory on him or were you close with Anthony Solano?
Dear Logic,
I will brush up on my Solano history. I do know his son is a wealthy businessperson, and grandson is a practicing attorney primarily in Kane County. The Solano’s were once partners with Jack Cerone, Esq, in the old Brookwood Country Club days. However, after Jack Esq swindled Paul Jr of roughly 1-million dollars and got away with it – meaning the bosses did not order Jack to return the money – the Solano’s pulled out of the country club. It was a good thing because Jack Esq eventually cheated the remaining partners out of their share when the place was purchased by DuPage County. Among the partners swindled by Jack Esq was local grocery mogul Paul Butera. The partners were cheated out of millions by Jack Esq. No one ever came after him because his father was alive (though in prison) and everyone was still afraid of him.
Not same Spano LOL!
Appreciate it Joe. I know Anthony was kicked out of the Laborers along with Joe Lombardo Jr. for continuing to hire guys like Joe Abate and others…so its obvious the Outfit pressures even the “princes” to continue their agendas. I also know the Solano’s were very wealthy from what Vince “Innocence” brought home, so wouldn’t doubt whether Anthony could use that fortune to build more fortune through investments. The attorney grandson is the namesake of the grandfather.
Speaking of unions something I was always curious about Coia Jr.–who played golf with Presidents–was tied to the New England family through his father, yet kicked a lot of Outfit guys out like the Caruso’s…do you think Chicago agreed to that with New England or do you think there was no communication between the families? This was like mid to late 90s.
Dear Logic,
I am not sure what the Outfits position was on that matter in the 1990’s. I will look into it.
Dear Readers:
It looks like Rudy Fratto is actually going to prison next week. Nothing filed as of yet to delay his surrender date (again). It would appear that he remains a bad guy.
logic: the solanos also had astake in golf course in glendale hghts.Another son is a dentist.as for joe greco its spelled GRIECO his nephew tom is also the one who had a meeting with mike sarno about a year ago at venutis.tom also has dealings with eddie greco (different spelling) in video gaming buis.that is sopposedly going legit in illinois.this is the new outfit quiet and insulated so you never know unless your there or part of that circle capish!!!!!!!!!!! joe.YOU need to check those two guys out but it might be to hard for you or you just wont scared of what youll find.the guys you write about are dead or all over the news this are the men who are the shakers and the movers and who own million dollar mansions in lake geneva and marco island. Love your work
come fly with me
come fly with me
let’s fly away
Dear Joe,
Why don’t you consider typing “exotic bird theft AND berwyn” into Google and see what happens?
I believe you’ve crossed swords with one of these individuals before.
Dear Bird,
That is interesting. I believe Erik and his wife threatened and harassed me and harassed Betty Loren-Maltese, via email, comments and facebook. The poor excuse of a police station called the Brookfield (Illinois) Police Department was incapable of accomplishing any results.
I see the dynamic duo (Erik & wife) is dealing with other things in DuPage County these days. I would not doubt it if they were stealing the bird to help cover Giacchino’s updated prices at the new Melrose Park Clinic.
Joe, I enjoy this website and reading some of the post although some on here seem to be very misguided, crackpots, or envious (in a bazaar way) that the Outfit still exist.
I actually would like to know what you know about Solly Delaurentis? I find him to be very interesting for a multitude of reasons other than he is in fact “made man” and did 16 years in prison while doing it on top of his head…as if he was born to do the time “no big deal right”. Anyhow I have good sources out the New York way that have Bruce Cutler years ago during the Infelise/Delaurentis trial that have him talking off the record that Solly D was worth about as much as John Gotti. And Cutler would def know. He represented both men. Very interesting that he would say Solly a made man but a soldier at the time nonetheless had about as much of a net worth as the Gambino Boss. And I do know unequivocally that Solly took care of Bruce when he was in Chicago for the trial and after-words.
I don’t know if it is mere coincidence but Solly towards the middle and end of his sentence was housed in the same Ohio Federal Prison as one Carmine Agnello sr. why is this interesting…well Carmine was married to Victoria Gotti (John’s daughter and has kids with her too those sons 3 reality kids Carmine jr, John and Frank of “Growing up Gotti” fame) anyhow I do know Carmine was in awe of Solly during their stay in the fed joint. He of course would know of him because of Bruce Cutler.
I’m just wondering if you think the Gambino’s and the Outfit have any joint ventures going on?? Because I do know Carmine Agnello is a made guy in the Gambinos and probably very very high ranking given the fact all the Corozzo’s are locked up, as is Arnold. And John Gotti jr is taking a very-very-very small role for obvious reasons. And John Damico is a street boss (acting street boss).
Anyhow back to Solly..I do know he is a hell of a father to his kids (i believe he has 3 daughters and 1 son). His namesake son Salvatore Delaurentis jr. is very brilliant and use to work for the Chicago Mercantile Exchange although he did get popped for “commodities fixing” and I believe did 16 to 18 months in Federal Prison. And I do know when Solly jr. was younger he used to throw his dads name around at bars and clubs, but he defiantly grew up to be a very savvy businessman. I also have a good source and my own hunch that both the Salvatore Delaurentis divorce of his wife is a financial ploy as is Carmine Agnello’s divorce from Victoria Gotti Agnello is a financial ploy…basically they are doing what Lumpy did first when he divorced Marion.
I do know Solly still lives in Inverness with a new young wife now and his ex wife a very good woman still lives in South Barrington and Solly jr and his wife Sharyn live in Barrington. So this Bruce Cutler and my source must have been right about this endless Delaurentis income. I was wondering JOE and others if you have any insight to what position Solly might hold in the Outfit (I have my own insights but was wondering yours??)…after all the guy did do 16 years in prison with his mouth shut and has gained extensive contacts throughout the US and especially with certain ambitious capable “New Yawkers”. I’m also going to discuss Marco Damico later on in the week and his prison stay in Milan, Michigan with the Calabrese’s and Jimmy Marcello. Marco in my estimation is a very smart man and very feared all while being an alcoholic lol. Great website and love to hear back from youse. Ciao.
Dear Black,
Despite what Cutler is supposed to have said, I simply cannot buy it. No way does Solly have the kind of money Gotti had. I am aware that Solly was considered wealthy before he was imprisoned, again, but not as wealthy as Gotti, not in my opinion. Solly has an additional son, Vince, which he fathered with a woman other than the mother of his older children.
While it is considered a noble cause by other gangsters for an Outfit member to do their prison time ‘on your head’ so to speak, the one person that Solly protected well was Rocky. And Rocky is dead. However, I am certain that Solly could hurt Marco and Johnny DiFronzo if he wanted to.
I have heard from reliable sources that in the years prior to Solly’s involvement the Outfit and the Gambino’s of New York shared some mutual interests. However, I cannot imagine what could be shared today, regardless of Solly’s forced connections to them.
Thank you for your complements, which mean a lot coming from someone as knowledgeable as you appear to be.
Sincerely,
JF
Joe,
I figured since you may have some connections to the Melrose Park area that I’d ask you if you happen to know the manager of… (YOUR COMMENT WAS MODIFIED – it was unrelated to the article. Thanks, American News Post)
Dear Readers,
According to a source, Aiuppa confidant and former Melrose Park Police Chief Vito “Drumhead” Scavo recently received a visit from his wife. My source indicates that “Drumhead” was crying about being away from his wife and family and complained that he is not feeling well. His wife informed him that she is running a daycare out of her home to make extra money. Surely, the IRS will be checking in on her profits in the near future.
Thanks for the complements Joe…I try to give the facts…although sometimes what i’m told via sources can be well half-truths, a lil innuendo so on and so forth. But I have a couple of good sources I feel. I just tend to take in all the information and sometimes form my own educated “fact” or opinion…but now I have you lol so you can answer some of my questions and I may or may not agree with you…although you seem very knowledgeable. As for Solly Delaurentis being worth about as much of a John Gotti..I tended to error on the side of half truth on that one. Only because John Gotti was known to be a degenerate gambler and his income was very hard to keep track off because he really didn’t hold any assets (like a John Difronzo or Solly)…Gotti use to say “he didn’t believe a gangster should invest his money into legitimate things (strange I know)”…His son in law Carmine Agnello (who I discussed before) had a many of assets and a good scrap metal business (multi million business). I just think it appeared on the surface to a Cutler or my sources that Solly was worth more (even tAs for Solly Delaurentis being worth about as much of a John Gotti..I tended to error on the side of half truth on that one. Only because John Gotti was known to be a degenerate gambler and his income was very hard to keep track off because he really didn’t hold any assets (like a John Difronzo or Solly)…Gotti use to say “he didn’t believe a gangster should invest his money into legitimate things (strange I know)”…His son in law Carmine Agnello (who I discussed before) had a many of assets and a good scrap metal business (multi million business). I just think it appeared on the surface to a Cutler or my sources that Solly was worth more (even tied up in investments) and it still seems that way to this day. Solly D is defiantly not in financial trouble like some…anyhow on to other things.
Okay I read some earlier post and someone had made a comment about there being alot of dead people on SB’s Chicago Outfit 2010 chart (which there is a couple)…however the person used Bruno “the bomber” Roti as an example. In defense of SB the chart is a nice try, very nice try…as for Bruno Roti there is in fact a Bruno Roti still alive (it’s the late crooked alderman’s Fred Roti’s son)..SB must of added “the Bomber” part as for some added bs melodrama effect. But their is in fact a Bruno Roti still alive and he has been arrested before (I think it had something to do with cars and or chop shops…I could be wrong).
Okay now on to more interesting things. Joe I would like to know what you have heard about or know about involving your ex pal Johnny Bananas Difronzo linking him in 3 possible murders…the 1st one is the murders of 3 women in the mid 1940s known as the “Lipstick Murders”…I had one source maybe 10-12 years ago who was in his 70s at the time and of Italian decent tell me John DiFronzo knew William Heirens (the man who was convicted of the brutal “Lipstick murders” in 1946 and is still alive till this day in a Illinois prison) very well and started off commiting burglaries and robberies all throughout Chicago starting in 1944 (both where 16 years old at the time)…Heirens has always claimed his innocence even saying he was beat into a confession, but when asked who did it he would never say “for fear of retaliation”.
Anyhow given the fact you think Bananas DiFronzo is a Hannibal Lector type…coupled with my very reliable source that says Bananas knew William Heirens very well and started off committing 2-bit burglaries with his pal William in the mid 1940s at the tender driving age of 16. Could it be true?? I was also told John DiFronzo got his nickname “Bananas” because he was truly Bananas in the 1940s…before he got his nickname “No Nose”…I’m just wondering if you heard of maybe your ex pal DiFronzo’s possible involvement in these 3 gruesome brutal murders. I’m not accusing him of anything, but it seems to be fact they defiantly where commiting robberies and burglaries together around the same time of these 3 brutal murders Heirens was accused of..also like I said coupled with the fact you think Bananas “is Hannibal Lector”.
Ironically my source was in Joliet in the year 1950 (he was 22 or 23 at the time)and he said John and William use to walk the prison yard together every morning for about a year straight, or until John was released. William of course was down for LIFE for the 3 murders and John was doing time for a smash and grab on Michigan Ave. My source was down on a armed robbery. And I don’t know if my source was messing with me (although this is a very serious man)..he said John DiFronzo still till this day manages through certain channels to get his old pal William a lot of money on his “books” for commissary (William has no family left) and has been sending him money in prison since 1953 or so as a sign of good gesture or he’s been keeping his word he’d help him finacially until one or the other died first.
The 2nd murder possibly involving DiFronzo is that of Westside Politician Charles Gross (I believe that’s his name)…DiFronzo was a suspect in late 1952. One of my sources says he thinks a guy named MESI (last name only) did it and your ex pal was possibly a driver. My source did say he was picked up and did not say a word…I think Frank Pape (the notorious ball bustin Chicago cop) even picked him up and threatened to beat the you know what out of him but “Bananas – No Nose” did not beef.
I will talk about the 3rd possible DiFronzo murder involvement tomorrow which took place in 1962..I’ll also later on will talk about Joseph Ferriola’s role in the murder of black policy maker Teddy Roe in 1952, that is very interesting. I would love to hear what you know JOE about the latter “possible” 2 murder roles John DiFronzo may have played a part in the “Lipstick Murders” and the “Charles Gross” murder…Thanks Joe.
Dear Black,
I have no idea what Solly is worth. I have no idea what he was worth before he became a gangster. However, one thing for sure is that Solly was never a boss (except for that rather modest and brief stint in Lake County, Illinois – this does not compare to New York), unlike Gotti. That in itself speaks for a great deal of financial substance or lack of.
As to your Heirens theory, I do not buy it. I also know someone that was locked up with Heirens and remains in contact with him today. My source is of the impression that Heirens is guilty. However, I do not want to reexamine the facts of the Heirens case, I simply want to point out that I do not believe that DiFronzo was involved. I do not see any evidence that would suggest such a thing. I do not belive that my assertion that DiFronzo is a mutilator is enough to make him a likely suspect in the Heirens case.
I do not know anything about the Gross or Roe murders, other than what I have read in the media.
I do believe Heirens is guilty too (of one murder)…but of all the murders “give me a break”…You have to understand this was Chicago and Chicago in the mid 1940s…You did one murder, you did them all “so they could have a case closed thing so to speak”. I’m not accusing John DiFronzo of anything either. I just know from good reliable sources they knew each other..they even looked very much alike in those days…same height, weight, complexion, hair-style, same tough kid swagger. My source says back in the summer of 1945 or around that time he witnessed at a Westside café/pool hall on numerous occasions…John Difronzo, w/ Pete and Joe D. (his brothers), Joseph Andriacchi used to come into the café with his brothers Dominick, and James…he also said Joseph Lombardo would sometimes be with the Andriacchi boys and he too would come with one or two of his own Lombardo brothers.
My source also said a curly-head, blue eyed boy no older than 9 years old would come into the cafe with boxing gloves and always dirty clothes (I guess he used to fight in Cicero at one of Aiuppa’s boxing clubs)…he said everybody called the Curly head boy “Co Co” or “Mani Grandi” (meaning big hands in Italian) the kid “Co Co” had huge big hands for his age. John DiFronzo use to say the kid “Co Co” was going to be the next Rocky Marciano… my source never did know the kid “Co Co” real first name but he believes decades later that that kid was in fact one Marco Damico. The only reason he believes that young boy to be Marco was because he would come into the café with a boy named Guy on some occasions. Marco had a brother named Guy. Plus he fit the description I guess and also he found out years/ decades later Marco was a young boxer in Aiuppa’s 1940 and 50s Cicero. I found it humerous DiFronzo in 2009 told Chuck Goudie of ABC7 News he’s never met a Marco Damcio or “didn’t even know who he is” lol. When he’s probably known him his whole natural life.
Anyhow my source says unequivocally William Heriens always frequented the café/pool hall that summer of 45 and I guess William was at the same psycho level of a Frank Schweihs…very nuts and very capable of almost anything. I guess all the DiFronzo’s, Andriacchi’s, Lombardo’s and Hierens would do all day was scheme and figure out ways to impress Ross Prio. So I guess they figured Burglary was the best way and maybe an occasional murder or two if it benifited them or impressed Ross Prio. My source did say he never did know William’s last name (he just figured he was related to the DiFronzo brothers because he looked like them)…a year later (1946) when he was arrested for all those murders…He put two and two together and figured out William’s real last name with his face in all the Chicago Daily’s.
Do understand Joe Fosco there is really no evidence pointing towards John “Bananas” DiFronzo in any of the Lipstick Murders…all I did was take what I knew about William and John’s “burglary relationship” and couple that fact that you accuse DiFronzo of being a Hannibal Lector….I will say this or ask you this…You seem to have certainty that DiFronzo is a Hannibal Lector type…Well do you think he woke up one day in the 1970s and said to himself “yeah I think I’m going to be a torture killer today”…I don’t think so…My guesstamation is that he had decades of practice at this sort of art or even hell was born with this sort of “mean streak”…if youd call It that. But by no means am I accusing him of some of those murders…I just have strong evidence William didn’t kill all those people…they (the Chicago Police) just said he matched a description of a dark complexion male “Italian” man wearing a trench coat and the Cook County States Attorney Touhy framed him on a lot of those murder counts to be done with the case. Ciao. By the way give me a week I’m going to try and give you the name of that café/pool hall they all hung out at.
Dear Black,
I agree with you on the theory that Chicago Police dumped as many crimes as they could on someone once they caught a criminal committing a crime (in the 50’s and earlier).
I stand by my earlier assertion that Johnny DiFronzo is a mutilator. However, again, I will not agree with you on the “Lipstick” murders.
Although, I certainly believe that DiFronzo is capable of committing such crimes – he has done so many times.
One thing I have to say is that I am somewhat intrigued that you have assembled such a possibility.
why does the fbi go after him joe
Dear Joey,
Why does or does not? The FBI has gone after DiFronzo, just not in the way you would expect.
What do you mean? Are you talking assets? Tax cases? What?
Dear And the dancefloor,
The Government put DiFronzo behind bars before is all I meant.
joe,
how many d.u.i’s do you have, and what exactly did you do to get out of them? as in, what phone conversations were made, and to whom? can you prove or disprove how you may answer this question?
what exactly did you accomplish with the franklin charitable foundation? can you furnish receipts of donations you received and made? can you provide tax returns for the foundation?
by the way, just some friendly advice… (YOUR COMMENT HAS BEEN MODIFIED – harassment and threats are prohibited on this site. Thank you, American News Post)
Dear IP Address 208.86.77.70,
I have never been guilty of DUI in my entire life, not in Illinois, not anywhere. Furthermore, I have never taken part in unlawful phone calls regarding judicial matters of any kind.
I accomplished many wonderful things at the Franklin Charitable Foundation. I donated money to Loyola Hospital and was appointed to their Leadership Society, which was done prior to discovering that Loyola Hospital helped former Dr. Joseph Giacchino avoid prosecution (see here: http://americannewspost.com/?p=170 ). In addition, I established a fund in the name of a murder victim named Sahara Moorer (see here: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3072351 – read final paragraph of link), as well as many other good projects. In fact, Garrett Reidy testified under oath about the good work done thru the Franklin Charitable Foundation, which was prior to my discovery that Reidy was a disgraced attorney.
As far as records, I saved all charitable records for 5-years as required by law before eliminating the expense in storing such records. With the exception of a few hundred dollars from a couple of close friends, please be advised that every penny spent thru the Franklin Charitable Foundation was my personal money that I inherited many years ago.
Do Not Ever Threaten My Family or Me Again!
did someone in the cerone family finally find this website?
lol
Umm now the “——– hideout” sign is down? It was up the entire summer.
joe,
you were never a labor arbitrator. prove it.
yes, you’ve never been… (YOUR COMMENT HAS BEEN MODIFIED – repetitive rants are considered harassment by our management team and forbidden on this site. Thank you, American News Post).
i hear you owe… money. why is that? (YOUR COMMENT HAS BEEN MODIFIED – repetitive rants are considered harassment by our management team and forbidden on this site. Thank you, American News Post).
oh no! joe fosco has an ip address. did you ever think i could be using a computer at an apple store, library, or borrow someone’s comoputer at a coffee shop for $5? i could use someone’s cell phone for god’s sake… (YOUR COMMENT HAS BEEN MODIFIED – libelous statements are forbidden on this site. Furthermore, your comment proves your intent to harass. Every time you ask someone to barrow their phone to send harassing comments to this site, you are exposing your physical identity to an eyewitness. Thank you, American News Post).
mr. cerone still has all the voice mails you ever left him… (YOUR COMMENT HAS BEEN MODIFIED – libelous statements are forbidden on this site. Thank you, American News Post).
i never… (YOUR COMMENT HAS BEEN MODIFIED – false statements and insults are forbidden on this site. Thank you, American News Post).
Dear IP Address 66.251.244.218,
I thought it was understood that I was never an actual labor arbitrator; I have never stated that I was. In fact, I explain it in detail here: http://americannewspost.com/?p=66
Yes, my finances are somewhat compromised right now. You are asking me why my finances are compromised. Ask John and Peter DiFronzo, Rudy Fratto, Jack P. Cerone, Esq., and Joseph L. Giacchino, Jr.
As to the voice mails that I left Jack P. Cerone, Esq., regarding the threats on my life that he played a part in, you may read the court transcripts, which detail the voicemails, here: http://americannewspost.com/?p=278
In addition, you may access this article, http://americannewspost.com/?p=819, which provides a very clear understanding of the details pertaining to the voicemails that you have mentioned. Thank you.
Please Cease And Desist With Your Lunacy!
Sincerely,
Joseph Fosco
Guess Pelicen Lake was right.
Joe, are you going to cover the Sarno trial? What do you know about Bobby Salerno Sarno’s mentor.
Dear Father,
I just might do that. I know quite a bit about Alex’s father.
Solly d is located in island lake has a carpet cleaning company i find him a very engrossing characther joe he might want to talk i see him every once in a while at Giannis some he tags around with some ugly broad jingle bells or something i forget her name let him talk carpet cleaning and then open him up pals with petey and zitella alot see what you can get
When am I going to get my Nick Gio article??
Dear HP,
You have been very patient. Perhaps that has been the problem. Without you constantly reminding me, I fell of the wagon as far as getting the article done. However, I am afraid that with the case currently being heard by the Illinois Supreme Court or the Illinois Appellate Court, we might want to wait until an answer is given before writing the article. I would like to be as thorough as possible when I do the piece.
Hey Fosco,
Is it true that old man Cerone used to have his way with some of the wives of his own crewmembers? I heard that Cerone used to have a ‘special’ relationship with Lefty Cacciatore’s wife. Their son, Gene, is a Melrose Park Police Officer.
Dear Feeds,
I definitely know the answer to your question; however, I do not think that sharing the answer could serve any good. Thank you for your interest in the comment threads.
Who are Mitt and Lucy?
t
Hey Logic
Are you sure that Sarno’s daughter is married to Sammy I?
Sarno’s daughter comes into my work a couple times a month. She’s only like 19 or 20 I think. She’s a very nice person. She’s an undergrad student, I’m pretty sure–not a married woman.
Are you sure you don’t have her confuse with someone else.
Haha…Joe “the builder” (that MOTHER!)
Dear Mr. Jingle,
Joe A’s daughter is married to a professional sports player and lives on the East Coast.
Jow DO you know of any connection between the Outfit and the Village of Berkeley IL. (Berkeley is sandwiched over there by Bellwood, Hillside, Elmhurst, Northlake).
I’ve heard things about Esposito, Berkeleys mayor, and I know that Casey (szaflarski) owns some homes over there. Jimmy Marcello’s son might own a house over there too. There’s like 6 cops in the whole town and all the old-timers get a pass when they fly off the handle. (like the D’Andreas…LOL)
How about it?
Dear Mr. Jingle,
I know nothing off hand. I know where Berkeley is located. I will look into it for you.
Joe, first time I’ve seen this thread. I went on to the link to this guy named Berstein and looked at his chart. HIS CHART IS WORSE THAN ROEMER’S CHART! It’s the worst I’VE EVER SEEN about the Outfit.
Dear The Don,
I agree.
What do you remember about Stuffy Ciconte?
Dear Michael,
I would have to consult with one of my sources on that and I will. Thanks.
I only know what I’ve read in newspaper’s which I know is not always accurate. Any stories or help would be great, particularly in regards to South America.
Joe, what was the relationship between Ross Prio & Jack Cerone? Prio was a very strong Capo of the North Side Crew for a long time. Back in the 1960’s, my uncle was a soldier in the Elmwood Park Crew. He was falsely accused by a soldier in the North Side Crew of selling drugs on the side while working as a ‘juice collector’ and vending machine collector. The soldier from the North Side Crew accused my Uncle of this behavior in a bar in front of some other people. My uncle grabbed him by the throat and smashed his head into the wall really hard which I believe knocked the guy out briefly. That ended the fight but was only the beginning! The soldier complained about it to the made guy he was with and the made guy told Ross Prio. Ross Prio sent word over to Elmwood Park about the fight and the accusation. A ‘sit down’ was scheduled between Prio and Cerone to be held in Cicero, which at that time was the territory of Joey Auippa, before he became the Top Boss of the Outfit. My uncle was scared that if this was not settled by the two Capos, then it would have gone to the Top Boss of the Outfit who was Mooney during this time period. At the last minute, Cerone was ‘busy’ and didn’t want to go so he sent his underboss ‘Joe Gags’ to the meeting. Joe Gags & Jack had the same basic relationship that Andriacchi had with Lee Magnafichi in that Gagliano helped Cerone run the Elmwood Park Crew. The big difference, though, was that Lee was a much nicer person than Cerone. Anyway, at the meeting it was said that Joe Gags was so upset that one of his underlings was being falsely accused of something, that the guys in Elmwood Park could ” hear him yelling all the way from Cicero” It was revealed, that the guy from whom my Uncle was collecting payments was selling pills or something of that nature. No apologies were made, the subject was dropped, and my uncle and the other man were ordered never to be in the same room. What’s the point of the story? Joe Gagliano really cared about the men in Jack’s crew. Jack, on the other hand, really didn’t give a damn and that’s exactly why he would have been knocked down when he got out of prison. The irony would also have been that a couple of his OWN MEN would have done it under the orders of Auippa. My uncle loved Willie & Joe Gags but despised Cerone.
Dear The Don,
Unfortunately, I am unaware of the level of quality of friendship or rapport between Cerone and Prio. I will look into it, but please do not expect anything worthwhile from me on the subject.
Thank you for the story about your uncle. The portion of your story, which hints to Cerone’s lack of consideration for his men reminded me of a story that I know, which I heard from an actual eyewitness. Sometime in the 1960s, Jack and some of his guys were having a few drinks one afternoon at the original Armand’s Restaurant in Elmwood Park on Grand Avenue. Jack was having a nice time bragging about his son’s recent accomplishment of becoming an attorney and being in private practice. All of Jack’s guys that were present expressed their congratulations to Jack. When cocktail hour was ending, Joey A said his goodbyes and departed. Two-minutes later, everyone heard a big crash from outside. Johnny ran outside to see what happened. When Johnny returned, he told everyone that Joey had just been in a car accident with another car. Jack quickly pulled out his sons new law office business card and told Johnny to give Joey the card so he could give his son some law business. Johnny took the card, but said “Jack, it looks like the accident was Joey’s fault.” Jack said, “then give the business card to the other guy.”
Joe,
Did you see this?
http://abclocal.go.com/wls/story?section=news/iteam&id=7950067
Dear P,
No, I did not see it prior to you sending it to me. Thank you.
The young Mr. Spilotro, Chuck Goudie and the administrator of the Museum in Nevada are mistaken that Tony Spilotro was an Outfit boss running Chicago’s rackets in Vegas, or they are perpetuating a fraud. I am hoping it is a mistake. If he could put a couple of bucks in his pocket because of his fathers interesting life, which is obviously what he wants to do, more power to him.
I am disgusted by Goudie’s interest in such a story, misusing his media power; wasting valuable airtime on something so unimportant reminds me of the many sad and ridiculous segments he had produced over the years. I suppose Goudie struggles for anything he can find when there is nothing too pressing going on.
Joe, Vincent Spilotro is friend of mine and a good guy. I’ve personally spoken to him about the MOB EXPERIENCE which is going to open at the Tropicana Hotel in Las Vegas next month. They are going to have artifacts from Meyer Lansky, Bugsy Siegel, Sam Giancana & Tony Spilotro. Mooney’s daughter Antionette is also involved. It’s an entertainment facility built within the Tropicana where people will pay a fee and go into the museum. When they are in there, they will have to make certain choices and at the end they will either get knocked down, go to jail , or get made. It’s strictly entertainment to make money. You & I
Dear The Don,
I see.
Would find it amusing and somewhat ridiculous, but that’s basically what it is. Vincent knows his father was not the MOB BOSS of Las Vegas. All the hype is all show business exaggeration.
Dear The Don,
Going on the news and taking advantage of Goudie’s stupidity to manipulate free advertisement is exactly what an a** hole like Goudie deserves. However, according to the news segment, coupled with your assertion (if correct), Mr. Spilotro committed a material fraud, or at least the conspiracy to commit fraud, until a patron to see the fraudulent mob boss’ museum spends the fist dollar, which is when the actual fraud would be consummated. It is not too late for Mr. Spiotro to redeem himself. On the other hand, I suppose no one would be able to prove or disprove that his father was a boss.
I am not trying to start an argument. I am simply pointing out something interesting.
Joe, I hear what you’re saying, but in all honesty, Vincent isn’t saying his father was a mob boss, OTHER PEOPLE are saying it like that dummie Goudie. What bothers Vincent, is how his father was portrayed in the movie, Casino. In the movie, Tony was portrayed as an out of control lunatic. The movie was too exaggerated in this regard and Vincent wants to show that his father was not exactly like that and that he had a good side to him. That movie really bothered him.
Dear The Don,
Yes, it is clear in the interview that Goudie continually misstates that the elder Spilotro is a now deceased Outfit boss that was running rackets for the Outfit in Las Vegas (not verbatim); and the younger Spilotro goes along with his false statements; never exercising his duty to correct the inaccurate information spewed by Goudie. When someone sets out to charge consumers money for something, the merchant has a duty to the consumers to provide what is being paid for. Obviously the museum would do better promoting artifacts of a purported Outfit boss with great powers such as ruling Las Vegas, rather than if it promoted the truth, which pertains to artifacts of a common criminal with no authority by the Chicago Outfit whatsoever. I realize that it is a fraud that will go unprosecuted. However, does that make it right?
Getting back to Goudie, he is clearly misinformed like most people that Tony Spilotro was an Outfit boss; however, according to your assertion, the young Spilotro knows that Goudie is incorrect, but he decided to use it to his advantage for the purpose of making money (and I know for a fact that at least one other Spilotro is aware that Tony was not a commissioned Outfit boss ruling Vegas). The young Spilotro had the opportunity in the interview to correct Goudie, but chose not to do the right thing. Instead, the falsehood was broadcast to millions of unsuspecting viewers as the young Spilotro allowed Goudie’s misrepresentation to millions of people for the purpose of making money. One could be cruel and say, “The apple does not fall far from the tree.” However, I will not say that.
The Don, in your opinion, if a merchant defrauds consumers and cannot be prosecuted because of grey areas, does that make it right for the fraudster to swindle the consumers?
I understand that the young Spilotro has a great deal of mental anguish going on in relation to what happened to his father and because of the movie Casino. Nevertheless, if we gave a fraudulent racket (museum exhibit) to every adult child of a murder victim that had a bad reputation and a criminal record, we would be a lot worse off as a country than we are right now. Frankly, it seems to me that Mr. Spilotro could benefit by seeking adequate professional help.
Do you know what I would support? I would support Goudie exploiting the adult child of a murder victim whose late parent accomplished something positive in life, who deserves an exhibit in a museum. As I have said a number of times, Goudie is an a** hole. In fact, ABC News is a news station that I will now boycott, until Goudie is gone.
Dr. Pat Spilotro deserves to have an exhibit in a museum. That man raised approximately 10-children and over 90% of them are highly successful. All of his children are legitimate. And, nearly half of them hold doctorates in medicine and law. Where is Dr. Pat’s museum exhibit?
I will resume watching ABC News either when Goudie is gone, or when he exploits Dr. Pat’s good deeds in connection with a museum exhibit being opened in Pat’s honor. Thank you.
Furthermore, the young Spilotro could have used his time with Goudie to say, I am turning down the Las Vegas museums wish to further exploit my fathers death. Instead, I am establishing a cause for children of murder victims in the name of my grandparents (or Uncle Pat). Instead, the young Spilotro perpetuated the fraud and plans to further exploit his father’s death for money.
Again, perhaps the young Spilotro would benefit from adequate professional help. He is in my prayers.
Joe, from my understanding, the people who will be making the real money from the MOB EXHIBIT will be the Production Company & the Tropicana, not Vincent or his mother. Also, there is a big difference between a ‘fRAUD’ and an ‘EXAGGERATION’. To say that Tony Spilotro was ‘ The Boss of the Las Vegas Rackets’ or to say he ran the ‘SKIM’ from some of the Las Vegas Hotels is an EXAGERATION but is not fraud. Spilotro was a made guy with the Chicago Outfit. Spilotro was very close with Joey Lombardo. When Lombardo went out to Las Vegas, Spilotro was with him at all times. let’s assume for arguement’s sake, that Spilotro committed murders on behalf of the Outfit’s interest in Las Vegas, then he certainly was involved. I agree that Goudie and guys like him are ridiculous. However, almost every reporter when talking about a prominent Outfit guy in Chicago, refers to them as ‘BOSSES’. According to the news media, every gangster in Chicago is a ‘BOSS’! That’s because they don’t know any better.
Dear The Don,
I would rather not argue with you about our difference of opinions as if I am prosecuting a fraud case and you are defending one. I see it as fraud; you see it as an exaggeration of the truth. And I am not going to get involved in all the quibbling. Thank you for your opinion. And if Spilotro stands to make a small portion of the money projected to come into the museum, his involvement in such a venture seems even more ridiculous than I initially thought (assuming your opinion is correct and it is not a fraud).
Joe, the grandson of Meyer Lanksy has donated some artifacts, Antionette Giancana has donared some artifacts,the grand daughter of Bugsy Siegel has donated some artifacts along with Vincent Spliotro & his mother, Nancy. If they all make a little money from it I say more power to them. It’s no big deal one way or the other. Remember, in show business, you’re always selling the ‘sizzle’ more than the steak. This MOB MUSEUM is strictly “show business”. They even have a couple of the guys from the television series ‘The Sopranos’ involved in the adverising! Anyway, enough said & I respect the fact that you simply don’t care for it.
Dear The Don,
The ongoing quibbling is unnecessary. I give up. However, since you raised the other issues, I would point out that Lansky, Giancana and Siegel were true leaders of the Outfit, or the Outfits rackets in Las Vegas, unlike Tony Spilotro who was misrepresented through the nonsense that Goudie spewed on his news segment last week, while the young Spilotro did not correct him (the news is news, not Hollywood).
Is the Museum going to indicate that Spilotro’s exhibit is based on the Hollywood connection to the movie Casino and that Spilotro was truly not an Outfit boss in control of Las Vegas like the others who have exhibits in the Museum? If so, Marty Scorsese, Barbara De Fina and Nicholas Pileggi should have exhibits there as well.
Thank you for your comment.
Being a survivor (so far) of the deadly wishes of the Chicago Outfit that have been made against me recently, which should have caused my death by now, I ask my readers to remember the men that lost their lives 82-years ago today in Chicago at the hands of Chicago Outfit killers. I could imagine how it felt those men to experience the fear of being on the other end of such a deadly force.
They are:
Peter and Frank Gusenberg
Albert Kachellek
Adam Heyer
Reinhart Schwimmer
Albert Weinshank
John May
Please keep these seven men in your prayers today, and offer prayer to their family members and loved ones who surely suffer today from this tragedy of so long ago.
Joe, you are correct on that one! I like your sense of humor. All is good.
Dear The Don,
Sense of humor? I am not following you? My being correct is a matter of your opinion, right?
Joe, What I meant was that you’re correct that HOLLYWOOD has elevated the stature of Tony Spilotro. I thought that it was also humorous to say credit should be given to Martin Scorsese etc. I was actually complimenting you on your comparison.
Dear The Don,
Thank you for the clarification and compliment.
Joe–
You frequently mention Teets Battaglia when discussing your father. Approximately what year did your father start working for Teets and were there any stories of note related to you about Teets? He and his brothers sound like true terrorists as were all the 42 gang–shooting cops, pregnant women, kidnappings, murder, etc.
Also…is the nickname really because he said something along the lines of “I’ll bust ya in the teets?” That makes him sound rather like a dumb thug, yet he was smart enough to rule the Outfit for a short time. He saw all his brothers murdered before him and saw his wife and daughter burried in hancuffs.
Dear Logic,
My father began doing things for Teets in the mid 1940’s, periodically. However, by the early 1950’s my father was a fulltime and permanent fixture in Teets’ crew. He often paired up my dad with Joe Shine (my namesake, minus the word ‘Shine’, lol) on various Outfit related matters. My father was with Teets until the end.
Please forward me the names of any pregnant murder victims. I would like to look into your allegation on that issue.
As far as stories, I do not have any worth telling. My dad was not a storyteller. I write about my experiences for the most part. And most of the information that I have learned about the Outfit (through others) mostly came from sources close to old man Cerone.
Joe, I read your thread about remembering the men who were killed in the St. Valentines Day massacre. However, let’s not forget that they were gangsters who belonged to ‘Bugs Moran’. They were not innocent victims of extortion like yourself. But, what happened to them was still terrible and the pain their families and the families of all Outfit violence suffer is terrible.
Dear The Don,
Again, thanks for the clarification.
I met Moran’s great-nephew a few times. He never read much about his great-uncle. His grandmother, Moran’s niece, never talked about Moran and was a religious woman.
Joe–Think you misunderstood…the Battaglia brothers were known as terrorists throughout Chicago.
Frank Battaglia is best known for the robbery shooting of a pregnant women named Mrs. Maria Pelletier. The mother of four, Mrs. Pelletier refused to allow Battaglia to steal her purse and fought back. Battaglia shot her through the head, took her purse and fled by car with other 42 gang members Sam Battaglia, Marshal Caifano and future democratic boss John D’ Arco.
Obviously the Outfit may have changed tactics by the 1940s and 50s, but it goes to show you what type of thug Sam Battaglia was. Do you know what ever happened to Frank? I know Sam’s other brothers were killed in various shootouts with police.
Here is a great article by historian John Toughy on the Battaglia brothers, which you’ve probably seen already. Guess I didn’t realize your father ran with Milwaukee Phil, Frankie Beto, Obbie Frabotta and others:
http://www.americanmafia.com/Feature_Articles_150.html
Dear Logic,
Thank you for the name of Mrs. Pelletier. Assuming Mr. Tuohy’s information is correct, I do not think it is fair to assign blame to Teets for something that his brother allegedly did. I do not have any evidence that would show me that my father was close with Frank Battaglia. Nor do I have any evidence that would show me that my father was close with Frank Beto or Obbie (although Obbie seems strangely familiar in my memory).
I do know that my father had dealings with Donkey Ears, Shine, Marshal and Milwaukee Phil. My father and Shine both controlled the El Morocco for Teets. However, be advised that Shine had more seniority with Teets than my father did, nonetheless, my father was extremely close to Teets.
Joe, I read the article written by the Irish fellow John Touhy about the Battaglia bothers that was referenced by Logic in the thread above. It was highly exaggerated and inaccurate. to be honest, it was borderline ridiculous, especially saying that Joe Ferriola was the underboss of the entire Outfit and made some kind of ruling in favor of Bucciere over Battaglia. There were many other inaccuracies. John Touhy made up most of this article on his own. This Irishman should write a story about Notre Dame football, not about the Outfit or the 42 gang.
Dear The Don,
I appreciate your credible input and clarification.
Ive always been interested in who really was running things. Where did Joey O fit in when Teets and phil where running things for Tony A and Paul R???
Just to be clear, Teets Battaglia is obviously not the same “Teets” from the threads, correct? Also, the Frank Battaglia from Logic’s narrative is different than the Frank Battaglia who is the subject of the ANP article, right?
Dear Merlin,
The infamous Teets died nearly 40-years ago. The convicted sex-offending pedophile Frank Battaglia (subject of ANP article) is rumored to be the nephew of Teets. Perhaps the infamous and late Frank Battaglia that according to Mr. Tuohy, shot and murdered a pregnant woman, is the father or grandfather of the pedophile named Frank. What a family tree, lol.
Joe, what year did Cerone go to prison concerning the gambling conviction with Ferriola, Cortina & Angelini? I believe it was around 1970. How many years did he serve? Was he gone when Joe Gags died?
Dear The Don,
I believe Jack was in prison between from sometime in 1970 to mid or late 1973 (approximately). I am confident that Joe died in late 1971.
Joe- first of all how are you related again to the Nappi family ? Please explain …
Here are some facts for you to know – first of all Mr. Tuohy ‘s article on Sam Battaglia is mostly incorrect. He never had any brothers involved in organized crime . There was another Battaglia family which lived in the old neighborhood at that time and were members of the 42 gang. Sam Battaglia’s original partner was Ralph (Baba) Nappi who died in 1941. Do you have any pictures of Baba that you can share ? His brother Romie was very fond of Sam Battaglia . Did they call your father “foxie” ?
Dear Golden,
Thank you for the information. I have very little knowledge of Teets’ family tree going back.
I am Romie Nappi’s nephew through marriage. My father married his youngest sister Gloria in the early 1940s, which was prior to his connection to my mother. My father never divorced Gloria, instead, engaged in a serious relation with my mother from 1961 until his death in 1987. Romie and my father were very close friends and their friendship withstood the difficulties involved in my father’s marriage to Gloria. After my father’s death, I established a relationship with Romie and Gloria. However, prior to his death, my father introduced us to his older children that he had with Gloria, Armando Jr and Ralph (my brother Ralph was named after Uncle Ralph and Teets. Brother Ralph’s middle name is Sam. Unfortunately, brother Ralph is seriously disabled). My personal connection to Gloria and Romie grew quite significant, especially because of my relationships with my brothers Armando and Ralph. I called Romie ‘Uncle Romie’ and Gloria ‘ma’. These relationships were mutually beneficial.
I visited Romie and Gloria multiple times per week for many years. Gloria is no longer well and is in need of professional assistance today.
I had lunch with Romie 2-days prior to his passing. The day he died, he retired to the den for a brief nap before lunch. When Aunt Maryon went to wake him, she discovered that he passed away. He became a recluse after Pat Marcy was indicted. By the late 1990s, Romie began suffering from senility. In the end, he did not remember who I was, but he still liked me. I shopped for him and his wife, Aunt Maryon, on a weekly basis.
My older brother explained to me the story about Uncle Ralph’s death, which took place in a saloon in Wisconsin. Apparently, a crazed customer who had been misbehaving left the establishment after a disagreement with Ralph, however, returned a short while later with a gun and murdered Ralph. The police arrived and took control of the situation. Teets tried to fix the murder case for Ralph’s killer to get him out of jail so he could personally express his feelings to the killer. However, the judge sensed that something odd was going to take place so he refused to go along with it. The murderer eventually died in prison. The late Mario Christopher (married to Romie’s sister Dolly) told me that the mother of Ralph’s killer used to write apology letters to Ralph’s mother Asunta.
I am aware of Ralph’s nickname as Bam or Bam Bam. He never married. He lived from 1911 to 1941. However, he was in a serious relationship with a young woman who he would have married if he had lived. If I recall correctly, Gloria explained to me that the woman never married after losing Ralph.
I was aware that Ralph was partnered with Teets. They worked for Ralph’s Uncle Tony Iori. Old man Tony Iori was Asunta’s brother. In addition, old man Iori was one of Capone’s close allies. In fact, Capone gave parts of Wisconsin and Northern Illinois to Iori as his territory, which involved gambling via slot machines. It was a lucrative business. Uncle Romie and my father eventually took over parts of the territory for a short while before Kefauver or McClellan killed it in the 1950s.
I will do my best to acquire some photos of Ralph; however, with Gloria’s health issues today it will be very difficult.
I do know that Teets loved Ralph so much that he took Romie under his wing and gave Romie a piece of whatever action he was in as his way of sharing with his old partner Ralph. Because of Ralph Nappi and Teets, every boss the Outfit ever had since Capone liked Romie. In fact, when I was on speaking terms with Johnny DiFronzo, he always asked me for reports on Romie’s health.
The nickname Foxie is familiar to me; however, I do not believe it belonged to my father. I will see what I could find on it.
The following article sheds light on some of the topics contained in this comment: http://americannewspost.com/joseph-fosco/1853/armando-%e2%80%9cmondo%e2%80%9d-fosco-sr/
Thank you for your comment.
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